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[Music]

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you're in the paracast

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the gold standard of paranormal radio

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and now

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so chris o'brien every spring

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takes what we might call if we lived in

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that country a walkabout

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so he is on his

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annual or semi-annual walk about now

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tell us about that when he gets back but

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he'll be gone for a week or two

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so

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in the meantime we'll have a guest

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co-host who may also be the guest

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so next week we'll have greg bishop this

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week we have micah hanks micah are you

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ready

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as opposed to born free which was a

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song of 30 40 years ago

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well you know in this country i'd like

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to think i am although i was telling a

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friend just earlier today uh about how

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you know i'm not one of these conspiracy

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theorists to at least to any extent that

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i think that uh one can be criticized

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these days you know like some of the

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websites the sensational kind of

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conspiracism that we see but i've

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noticed especially around the end of the

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month it is just so unbearable

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where i live in asheville the police

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presence a lot of people joke around

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about there being a police state but i'm

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pretty certain i was almost pulled over

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last night for doing absolutely nothing

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wrong i merely was driving at night i

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was kidding with my friend it's like

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there's a curfew or something around

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here and that people will say they're

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trying to meet quotas and whatnot and

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i'm not demonizing i've got friends in

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the asheville police department but you

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know nonetheless it does seem to be a

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little less free maybe than it once was

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born free huh

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yeah born free and then enslaved

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thereafter

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[Laughter]

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and you don't need a police force to do

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that gene we've got taxes for that right

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right but north carolina is already a

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controversial state because of that

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bathroom law and i don't want to get

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into that except i'll just point out for

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those who are either conservative

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liberal or whatever there is no report

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from any police department

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of anyone abusing anyone else as a

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result of going in the wrong bathroom so

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let's leave it at that that's what the

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police say i didn't say it i didn't make

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it up he's not the new york liberal but

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let's talk about a few subjects that

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came up in last week's episode which

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featured nick redfern and greg bishop

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and maybe you want to follow up and the

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question i asked first and you're a

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young whippersnapper so you may know

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this better than anyone else except for

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chris who of course is a musician and

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that is prince did prince ever do

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anything in terms of his music that had

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a paranormal aspect to it yeah as a

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matter of fact gene there was a lot of

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interesting stuff gosh i even have some

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sound bites of him talking about various

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things which we may or may not have to

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get to right now but i can definitely

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tell you the kind of things that he was

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interested in in some of his songs

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one particular called dreamer prince had

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uh talked specifically about uh you know

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while we're asleep at night you know

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there are chemicals being dropped over

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the city by helicopters and whatnot and

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it sounded like a reference to

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chemtrails now that may not be

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paranormal but it certainly is something

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that's prevalent in conspiracy

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literature now most people know the

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theories about chemtrails go back to

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around 1996

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there was a bulletin i think that was

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being put out on the web in various

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places probably not just a bullets and

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there were a lot of different theories

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and it had to do with the idea that

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again chemical agents were being

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released from aircraft

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most recently uh i think the newest form

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that this uh theory has taken was a

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world net daily article written

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by none other than action star chuck

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norris from the missing in action films

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and other such kung fu and karate movies

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although he was a chun kudo stylist

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himself it wasn't really kung fu that

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said when this article appeared it was

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interesting because although i think

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really some of the other celebrity

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deaths

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in the music world have been

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overshadowed by more recently prince and

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before that david bowie we also lost

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glen frye the eagles and merle haggard

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merle haggard just like prince had had a

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line of song that specifically said

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chemtrails and chuck norris references

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both of those songs the merle haggard

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tune and also dreamer by prince and so i

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was interested in whether or not prince

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had explicitly met chemtrails in this

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lyric in dreamer where they're talking

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about chemicals being dropped from above

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and sure enough there was a 2009

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interview that he did with tavis smiley

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the talk host in which he specifically

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states that he was very aware of the

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phenomena and there's a long pause where

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he's saying this he pauses as though

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he's kind of collecting his thoughts

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gene and then prince says this phenomena

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called chemtrails and he goes on talking

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specifically about when he was a child

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he said that they would be standing out

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in the yard and looking up at the sky

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and he said you'd see a contrail and go

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oh that's cool and he said over the

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years there would be more and more and

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more of them and he said he always

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believed that when they would appear

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everyone in the neighborhood would start

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fighting so he thought prince did that

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the chemtrail phenomena was some sort of

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a measure to control mood and behavior

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through the release of chemicals into

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the atmosphere chuck norris on the other

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hand in his recent world net daily

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article had uh inferred this had been

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more likely to be something used for

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purpose of immunization but to immunize

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the populace without their knowledge you

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know it's it's interesting there was a

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bulletin that was released by the air

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force a number of years ago in which it

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actually tried to debunk some of the

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chemtrail theories but the funny thing

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is is that you know what happens when an

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uh official agency dispels rumors about

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a conspiracy theory that only bolsters

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the claims in the minds of the

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conspiracists themselves

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so that was one thing that prince spoke

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about but i'll give you two other brief

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anecdotes thereafter when he was a child

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and this also from the tavis smiley

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interview that he did in 2009 prince

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also said that he was born with epilepsy

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yeah had you heard that before

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no i did not i do know

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that the authorities are looking into

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the fact that

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he apparently had some problems and had

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to take painkillers addictive

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painkillers opiates right see i wonder

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if there hadn't been some underlying

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health issues is the point but anyway

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about the epilepsy thing he said that he

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was born with epilepsy but that he

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believed he had been healed by an angel

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at an early age and he said that he

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didn't have conscious memory of this but

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that his mother always told him when he

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was a child that he walked into the room

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with her one day and told her mama i'm

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not going to be sick anymore and she

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says no why is that he said well i've

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been healed by an angel so that was the

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story his mother always told him and

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then right before his death gene this is

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also kind of interesting prince had had

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a gathering there

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at the paisley estate i don't think

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that's the actual name it's called

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paisley something he had a gathering in

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which there was i think a private

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concert there at his home

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and he had said at that time

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apparently he'd also privately said to

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friends before this that he was a lucid

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dreamer and he said he regularly had

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lucid dreams and after david bowie died

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he said that bowie had come back and had

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uh spoken with him during some of these

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lucid dreams and that he he always

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relished being able to see friends who

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had passed on to the other side during

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these extremely vivid lucid dreams he

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had oh boy it looks like a lot of

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singers

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tend to get involved in this sort of

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thing

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i think so they tend to have a lot of uh

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how would you put this they have a lot

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of these um kind of esoteric interests

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uh and you might say that it's

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the the sort of abstract random nature

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of an artistic mind but i'll tell you

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who prince always reminded me of gene

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was uh jimi hendrix

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i remember particularly when i was a

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child seeing uh

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prince

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he was performing probably sometime in

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the mid 1990s

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at this point he was going by just the

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artist he had uh he'd kind of renounced

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his name there for a while and he was

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playing one of those wild funky looking

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guitars of his and i've never seen him

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play guitar and when i saw him play i

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was like wow this guy

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could be jimi hendrix reincarnated now

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he never claimed that that was the case

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but i mentioned hendrix because hendrix

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had apparently in order to kind of um

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inspire himself and i think chaz

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chandler who had been his uh his manager

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chaz chandler formula formerly of the

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animals chaz had also been one that

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would uh give hendrix sci-fi books and

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from time to time it was said that

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hendrix had read not only sci-fi but ufo

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books to help inspire his uh songs and

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the kinds of far-out-sounding songs that

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he wrote so you know whether or not

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there was any other kind of there's

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obviously and i think you can't deny the

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influence especially in his guitar style

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that prince has he was obviously

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influenced by hendrix but uh you know

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you're right it is something that you

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find a lot of

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musicians and artists do tend to kind of

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gravitate toward these subjects and are

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certainly interested in them

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but i was very interested to hear that

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merle haggard had been writing about

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chemtrails and i've also further heard

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that he was very interested in the

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paranormal in general

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and uh that a friend and fellow

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podcaster of mine recently jim harold

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had mentioned that yeah he said uh merle

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haggard had had all kinds of interest in

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ufos and things like that prior to his

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death so a lot of people i think really

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are more interested in these subjects

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maybe than many of us know well there is

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that that the fact that creative people

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tend to be carried along to the

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paranormal let me carry along you to

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this other thing that we offer

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got micah hanks

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comment or question about the paracast

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00:14:12,870 --> 00:14:09,600
send it to news at theparacast.com

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that's news at theparecast.com

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00:14:17,189 --> 00:14:14,720
and don't forget to visit our famous

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paracast community forums at

391
00:14:24,870 --> 00:14:23,670
we have micah hanks joining us this week

392
00:14:28,150 --> 00:14:24,880
as our

393
00:14:30,550 --> 00:14:28,160
combo guest co-host and guest

394
00:14:32,550 --> 00:14:30,560
we're keeping him busy and we started

395
00:14:34,389 --> 00:14:32,560
talking about music and rock but i want

396
00:14:36,230 --> 00:14:34,399
to jump into other subjects because we

397
00:14:38,389 --> 00:14:36,240
have so much to talk about here and

398
00:14:41,670 --> 00:14:38,399
we've got questions from our listeners

399
00:14:44,470 --> 00:14:41,680
so we also observed last week the

400
00:14:46,710 --> 00:14:44,480
passing of albert k bender

401
00:14:48,870 --> 00:14:46,720
who was very much responsible for the

402
00:14:51,509 --> 00:14:48,880
men in black legend not the first men in

403
00:14:53,430 --> 00:14:51,519
black case you can go back to a possible

404
00:14:55,509 --> 00:14:53,440
man in black encounter during maury

405
00:14:58,550 --> 00:14:55,519
island but did you

406
00:15:00,310 --> 00:14:58,560
do much studying of albert bender

407
00:15:02,389 --> 00:15:00,320
you know i'm quite familiar with uh

408
00:15:04,870 --> 00:15:02,399
albert's uh you know legacy i think

409
00:15:06,790 --> 00:15:04,880
especially with what some believe was

410
00:15:09,430 --> 00:15:06,800
the literal creation

411
00:15:10,710 --> 00:15:09,440
of the uh the men in black uh of course

412
00:15:12,629 --> 00:15:10,720
he was really

413
00:15:15,110 --> 00:15:12,639
now correct me if i'm wrong he had

414
00:15:16,550 --> 00:15:15,120
really been one of the most outspoken uh

415
00:15:18,629 --> 00:15:16,560
flying saucer

416
00:15:20,230 --> 00:15:18,639
uh advocates early on and he of course

417
00:15:21,269 --> 00:15:20,240
had had that publication that he had

418
00:15:23,509 --> 00:15:21,279
been putting out and there was that

419
00:15:26,710 --> 00:15:23,519
strange circumstance where he actually

420
00:15:27,829 --> 00:15:26,720
ceased the publication uh and had said

421
00:15:29,350 --> 00:15:27,839
rather cryptically that he had

422
00:15:31,509 --> 00:15:29,360
apparently come very close to finding

423
00:15:32,550 --> 00:15:31,519
out the secret behind flying saucers but

424
00:15:34,629 --> 00:15:32,560
that it was something that he couldn't

425
00:15:36,629 --> 00:15:34,639
really talk about very much the famous

426
00:15:39,110 --> 00:15:36,639
story is listeners here of course will

427
00:15:42,550 --> 00:15:39,120
know is that bender had been allegedly

428
00:15:44,470 --> 00:15:42,560
visited by individuals who really many

429
00:15:46,629 --> 00:15:44,480
kind of view this as one of the earliest

430
00:15:47,910 --> 00:15:46,639
at least as far as ufological

431
00:15:49,509 --> 00:15:47,920
appearances one of the earliest

432
00:15:52,230 --> 00:15:49,519
appearances of the men in black but you

433
00:15:54,389 --> 00:15:52,240
know some people when i um i think that

434
00:15:56,389 --> 00:15:54,399
probably nick redfern is the very most

435
00:15:58,230 --> 00:15:56,399
uh knowledgeable expert right now on the

436
00:16:00,550 --> 00:15:58,240
mib phenomena having authored not just

437
00:16:03,030 --> 00:16:00,560
one but many books on that

438
00:16:05,030 --> 00:16:03,040
he uh in one of his mib books had

439
00:16:06,150 --> 00:16:05,040
featured a series of essays by other

440
00:16:08,710 --> 00:16:06,160
writers

441
00:16:10,470 --> 00:16:08,720
and i had contributed one which will tie

442
00:16:12,550 --> 00:16:10,480
in with albert bender in a unique way

443
00:16:14,550 --> 00:16:12,560
here um the essay that i wrote was

444
00:16:15,670 --> 00:16:14,560
talking about really the prevalence of

445
00:16:18,870 --> 00:16:15,680
uh you know

446
00:16:21,509 --> 00:16:18,880
negativity and and darkness and and even

447
00:16:22,790 --> 00:16:21,519
death and evil that is associated with

448
00:16:24,310 --> 00:16:22,800
the color black

449
00:16:26,150 --> 00:16:24,320
and has been really the case throughout

450
00:16:28,069 --> 00:16:26,160
century you know if you all if you watch

451
00:16:29,350 --> 00:16:28,079
the old western films the bad guys wore

452
00:16:30,949 --> 00:16:29,360
black you know

453
00:16:32,790 --> 00:16:30,959
although really in many of the films

454
00:16:33,509 --> 00:16:32,800
actually the good guys did just as well

455
00:16:35,430 --> 00:16:33,519
so

456
00:16:37,829 --> 00:16:35,440
the uh the interesting thing is is that

457
00:16:40,470 --> 00:16:37,839
when we when we see um mysterious

458
00:16:41,910 --> 00:16:40,480
figures uh the motif that is very

459
00:16:45,110 --> 00:16:41,920
prevalent with men in black which is

460
00:16:47,269 --> 00:16:45,120
usually the uh you know the the the the

461
00:16:49,110 --> 00:16:47,279
black suit the tie sunglasses sometimes

462
00:16:50,470 --> 00:16:49,120
there's a hat that accompanies that uh

463
00:16:52,150 --> 00:16:50,480
we see it appear in a number of

464
00:16:53,910 --> 00:16:52,160
different kind of manifestations we can

465
00:16:55,670 --> 00:16:53,920
go all the way back to odin

466
00:16:57,189 --> 00:16:55,680
and when in the mythological lore

467
00:16:59,350 --> 00:16:57,199
associated with odin it was often said

468
00:17:01,430 --> 00:16:59,360
that he would wander in the in the form

469
00:17:02,949 --> 00:17:01,440
of an old man he would often wear a long

470
00:17:05,590 --> 00:17:02,959
brimmed hat like that and sometimes

471
00:17:07,029 --> 00:17:05,600
would be shrouded in in dark clothing

472
00:17:09,189 --> 00:17:07,039
robes and things like this so as to

473
00:17:10,309 --> 00:17:09,199
disguise himself as he traveled

474
00:17:12,150 --> 00:17:10,319
interestingly

475
00:17:13,990 --> 00:17:12,160
um various interpretations of that

476
00:17:16,150 --> 00:17:14,000
character are said to have

477
00:17:18,069 --> 00:17:16,160
become uh influential in the minds of

478
00:17:19,990 --> 00:17:18,079
authors that would appear later such as

479
00:17:21,909 --> 00:17:20,000
j.r.r tolkien odin had been one of the

480
00:17:22,949 --> 00:17:21,919
inspirations behind the gandalf

481
00:17:24,470 --> 00:17:22,959
character

482
00:17:27,029 --> 00:17:24,480
someone further said that uh that

483
00:17:29,190 --> 00:17:27,039
similar imagery of the man clad in black

484
00:17:31,270 --> 00:17:29,200
with the long brimmed hat and sometimes

485
00:17:33,750 --> 00:17:31,280
a scarf just as well there was one

486
00:17:35,830 --> 00:17:33,760
particular kind of a nouveau uh image

487
00:17:38,789 --> 00:17:35,840
that had allegedly been the uh

488
00:17:40,310 --> 00:17:38,799
inspiration behind tom baker the fourth

489
00:17:41,590 --> 00:17:40,320
doctor in the british sci-fi series

490
00:17:43,510 --> 00:17:41,600
doctor who his character and the

491
00:17:44,950 --> 00:17:43,520
appearance with the hat that he wore he

492
00:17:46,549 --> 00:17:44,960
didn't wear black by any means usually

493
00:17:48,230 --> 00:17:46,559
prefer brown coats and have the brown

494
00:17:50,549 --> 00:17:48,240
fedor with the wide brim and then the

495
00:17:52,950 --> 00:17:50,559
long long long scarf but that also had

496
00:17:55,029 --> 00:17:52,960
been kind of inspired by a very similar

497
00:17:56,549 --> 00:17:55,039
sort of man and black imagery you know

498
00:17:57,990 --> 00:17:56,559
in more recent times there was this

499
00:18:00,950 --> 00:17:58,000
interesting phenomena that occurred up

500
00:18:03,909 --> 00:18:00,960
there in uh in baltimore in which there

501
00:18:05,350 --> 00:18:03,919
was what was known as the poe toaster

502
00:18:08,310 --> 00:18:05,360
which i mentioned in the article that we

503
00:18:10,150 --> 00:18:08,320
did for uh nick's book the poe toaster

504
00:18:12,470 --> 00:18:10,160
was in likelihood not merely one person

505
00:18:14,070 --> 00:18:12,480
for at least a long time it was and then

506
00:18:15,909 --> 00:18:14,080
i think probably the progeny of the

507
00:18:17,430 --> 00:18:15,919
individual carried on the tradition but

508
00:18:19,029 --> 00:18:17,440
the story of the post hoster was that

509
00:18:21,830 --> 00:18:19,039
there was this man who once again in a

510
00:18:24,310 --> 00:18:21,840
long black either cloak or cape or other

511
00:18:25,990 --> 00:18:24,320
sort of garb a long brimmed black hat

512
00:18:27,350 --> 00:18:26,000
and then a red scarf about his neck

513
00:18:29,270 --> 00:18:27,360
sometimes it was a white scarf and

514
00:18:31,110 --> 00:18:29,280
sometimes he was carrying roses the

515
00:18:32,950 --> 00:18:31,120
story was that the man would walk

516
00:18:35,350 --> 00:18:32,960
through the streets and he would head to

517
00:18:37,350 --> 00:18:35,360
the grave of edgar allan poe at night

518
00:18:38,870 --> 00:18:37,360
and he would often do this without being

519
00:18:40,470 --> 00:18:38,880
accosted but as the years went on and

520
00:18:42,630 --> 00:18:40,480
the legend became more and more famous

521
00:18:44,549 --> 00:18:42,640
on the night coalescing into midnight

522
00:18:46,549 --> 00:18:44,559
and of course marking the advent of

523
00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:46,559
poe's birthday every year people would

524
00:18:49,669 --> 00:18:48,000
begin to gather on the streets and from

525
00:18:51,750 --> 00:18:49,679
time to time some people would actually

526
00:18:52,950 --> 00:18:51,760
harass the so-called poe toaster

527
00:18:54,630 --> 00:18:52,960
unfortunately i don't think that he

528
00:18:56,789 --> 00:18:54,640
appears any longer but the tradition was

529
00:18:59,029 --> 00:18:56,799
he would lay flowers and a glass of

530
00:19:00,470 --> 00:18:59,039
cognac well actually an entire bottle on

531
00:19:01,990 --> 00:19:00,480
the grave of edgar allan poe but he

532
00:19:03,110 --> 00:19:02,000
would partake in a glass raise it to the

533
00:19:04,710 --> 00:19:03,120
great poet

534
00:19:06,470 --> 00:19:04,720
and enjoy a beverage himself there

535
00:19:08,470 --> 00:19:06,480
before he left so you know once again

536
00:19:10,310 --> 00:19:08,480
the poe toaster kind of evokes that you

537
00:19:11,830 --> 00:19:10,320
know long brimmed hat the dark colored

538
00:19:14,549 --> 00:19:11,840
garb sometimes a scarf you don't hear

539
00:19:16,789 --> 00:19:14,559
very much about mibs wearing scarves but

540
00:19:18,549 --> 00:19:16,799
as far as ufological appearances of

541
00:19:20,310 --> 00:19:18,559
these kind of characters yeah bender was

542
00:19:21,830 --> 00:19:20,320
the first who said that these i think it

543
00:19:23,669 --> 00:19:21,840
had been three individuals of memory

544
00:19:25,430 --> 00:19:23,679
servers that came and visited him there

545
00:19:27,990 --> 00:19:25,440
he had inferred that they had been very

546
00:19:30,150 --> 00:19:28,000
intimidating and that these individuals

547
00:19:31,990 --> 00:19:30,160
had sort of silenced him yeah but you

548
00:19:35,110 --> 00:19:32,000
see the interesting thing about bender

549
00:19:37,510 --> 00:19:35,120
is that in 1962

550
00:19:39,510 --> 00:19:37,520
he came out with a book called flying

551
00:19:42,310 --> 00:19:39,520
saucers and the three men

552
00:19:45,190 --> 00:19:42,320
where these men in black were supposedly

553
00:19:47,110 --> 00:19:45,200
et's from a planet called chaoic with

554
00:19:48,870 --> 00:19:47,120
the silent z

555
00:19:50,789 --> 00:19:48,880
yeah it's kind of funny um there's a

556
00:19:53,350 --> 00:19:50,799
photograph in fact if you go to the

557
00:19:55,029 --> 00:19:53,360
wikipedia page for albert k bender

558
00:19:57,270 --> 00:19:55,039
there's a photograph where he's posing

559
00:19:59,909 --> 00:19:57,280
by one of those uh images which is the

560
00:20:02,310 --> 00:19:59,919
classic mib and what you find is with

561
00:20:04,070 --> 00:20:02,320
with his implication or the you know his

562
00:20:06,310 --> 00:20:04,080
his you know belief that these had not

563
00:20:07,750 --> 00:20:06,320
been individuals trying to silence him

564
00:20:09,750 --> 00:20:07,760
from perhaps a government agency but

565
00:20:12,150 --> 00:20:09,760
rather aliens themselves once again you

566
00:20:14,549 --> 00:20:12,160
find this kind of unique idea that

567
00:20:16,630 --> 00:20:14,559
begins to emerge in the ufo culture that

568
00:20:18,710 --> 00:20:16,640
there is some sort of an operation in

569
00:20:21,430 --> 00:20:18,720
which both the flying saucers and their

570
00:20:23,510 --> 00:20:21,440
occupants and official them are sort of

571
00:20:25,990 --> 00:20:23,520
working in tandem or that variously

572
00:20:27,750 --> 00:20:26,000
there is a ufo operation that is

573
00:20:29,750 --> 00:20:27,760
intermixed and interspersed within our

574
00:20:31,830 --> 00:20:29,760
own society you know in other words that

575
00:20:34,149 --> 00:20:31,840
they have vested interests here in earth

576
00:20:35,750 --> 00:20:34,159
and that they actually operate on it so

577
00:20:38,070 --> 00:20:35,760
yeah with with bender you find a lot of

578
00:20:39,669 --> 00:20:38,080
those earliest kind of formations of the

579
00:20:42,630 --> 00:20:39,679
various memes that you'd start seeing

580
00:20:44,870 --> 00:20:42,640
later in ufos and gene i i've begun to

581
00:20:46,630 --> 00:20:44,880
kind of look at it almost folklorically

582
00:20:47,990 --> 00:20:46,640
in in a lot of ways over the years i'm

583
00:20:49,430 --> 00:20:48,000
not saying that there isn't some truth

584
00:20:51,510 --> 00:20:49,440
behind these stories but i don't think

585
00:20:53,430 --> 00:20:51,520
we can deny that someone like bender

586
00:20:54,950 --> 00:20:53,440
claims to have an experience like this

587
00:20:56,470 --> 00:20:54,960
and that story is proliferated

588
00:20:58,470 --> 00:20:56,480
throughout various literature over the

589
00:20:59,990 --> 00:20:58,480
years by the time the story has been

590
00:21:02,230 --> 00:21:00,000
retold and retold and retold and

591
00:21:04,310 --> 00:21:02,240
appeared in so many books it has gotten

592
00:21:06,310 --> 00:21:04,320
to a point of being legendary in status

593
00:21:08,390 --> 00:21:06,320
and so many aspects of the story change

594
00:21:10,630 --> 00:21:08,400
it's very difficult and as a ufo

595
00:21:11,990 --> 00:21:10,640
culturist i guess you might call me i'm

596
00:21:14,789 --> 00:21:12,000
someone who looks at the culture that

597
00:21:16,630 --> 00:21:14,799
surrounds ufos the things that advocates

598
00:21:18,549 --> 00:21:16,640
say and the things that skeptics would

599
00:21:19,990 --> 00:21:18,559
say too as it relates to their various

600
00:21:22,310 --> 00:21:20,000
beliefs even though a skeptic is

601
00:21:23,830 --> 00:21:22,320
supposed to be a person who is in in

602
00:21:25,510 --> 00:21:23,840
their way of thinking antithetical i

603
00:21:27,350 --> 00:21:25,520
guess to believe they nevertheless have

604
00:21:29,350 --> 00:21:27,360
beliefs so i think that should really be

605
00:21:31,510 --> 00:21:29,360
pointed out but the way that belief

606
00:21:33,350 --> 00:21:31,520
about this subject has built up over

607
00:21:35,270 --> 00:21:33,360
time based on the legendary status that

608
00:21:37,510 --> 00:21:35,280
some of these stories take on over the

609
00:21:39,270 --> 00:21:37,520
years is probably to me more interesting

610
00:21:40,870 --> 00:21:39,280
in a lot of ways than the ufo phenomena

611
00:21:43,029 --> 00:21:40,880
itself and really i think fundamental to

612
00:21:44,230 --> 00:21:43,039
understanding it too albert bender was

613
00:21:47,270 --> 00:21:44,240
certainly one of those influential

614
00:21:50,549 --> 00:21:47,280
figures who lent a lot of legendary uh

615
00:21:52,630 --> 00:21:50,559
kind of themes to this broader phenomena

616
00:21:55,590 --> 00:21:52,640
bender had turned

617
00:21:57,430 --> 00:21:55,600
his attic where he lived i guess with

618
00:21:59,669 --> 00:21:57,440
his family his parents

619
00:22:01,270 --> 00:21:59,679
into kind of a chamber of horrors and

620
00:22:03,110 --> 00:22:01,280
this is something that nick referred to

621
00:22:06,149 --> 00:22:03,120
last week i just wanted to get your

622
00:22:08,870 --> 00:22:06,159
early reaction to it but the thing that

623
00:22:10,310 --> 00:22:08,880
we started to talk about last week and

624
00:22:12,230 --> 00:22:10,320
we didn't get through it it was only

625
00:22:13,750 --> 00:22:12,240
maybe three or four minutes in the final

626
00:22:15,990 --> 00:22:13,760
segment of the episode we had so much

627
00:22:19,750 --> 00:22:16,000
ground i thought i'd put this in your

628
00:22:21,510 --> 00:22:19,760
lap in terms of ufos and it's a belief

629
00:22:23,590 --> 00:22:21,520
in ufos

630
00:22:25,909 --> 00:22:23,600
as a possible solution or a part of a

631
00:22:28,630 --> 00:22:25,919
solution that really i don't think has

632
00:22:31,029 --> 00:22:28,640
really gained all that much traction

633
00:22:33,750 --> 00:22:31,039
and that's the story and the theories of

634
00:22:35,029 --> 00:22:33,760
the late trevor james constable and

635
00:22:36,789 --> 00:22:35,039
we'll talk about that in our next

636
00:22:39,110 --> 00:22:36,799
segment we have micah hanks of the

637
00:22:41,750 --> 00:22:39,120
grealian report chris o'brien's on

638
00:22:47,210 --> 00:22:41,760
walkabout so it's with gene and micah

639
00:22:47,220 --> 00:22:50,390
[Music]

640
00:22:55,230 --> 00:22:52,830
thank you for listening to

641
00:22:58,070 --> 00:22:55,240
gcn be sure to visit

642
00:23:00,149 --> 00:22:58,080
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643
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645
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647
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648
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650
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651
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652
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653
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655
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656
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657
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658
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659
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660
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661
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662
00:23:37,350 --> 00:23:35,600
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663
00:23:39,710 --> 00:23:37,360
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664
00:23:41,430 --> 00:23:39,720
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665
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666
00:23:45,830 --> 00:23:43,600
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667
00:23:47,750 --> 00:23:45,840
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668
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669
00:23:52,350 --> 00:23:49,440
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670
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671
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672
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673
00:24:05,029 --> 00:24:02,950
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674
00:24:07,669 --> 00:24:05,039
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00:24:10,149 --> 00:24:07,679
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676
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677
00:24:15,430 --> 00:24:12,480
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678
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679
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683
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684
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685
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686
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687
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688
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689
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693
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694
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695
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696
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700
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706
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708
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715
00:25:57,909 --> 00:25:55,279
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716
00:25:59,110 --> 00:25:57,919
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717
00:26:01,269 --> 00:25:59,120
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718
00:26:02,710 --> 00:26:01,279
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719
00:26:04,630 --> 00:26:02,720
with a true story that could save you

720
00:26:07,510 --> 00:26:04,640
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721
00:26:09,190 --> 00:26:07,520
linda just called her husband ray has a

722
00:26:10,390 --> 00:26:09,200
three hundred thousand dollar group life

723
00:26:12,310 --> 00:26:10,400
insurance policy

724
00:26:14,630 --> 00:26:12,320
but is changing jobs and can't take it

725
00:26:16,230 --> 00:26:14,640
with them well i am partially shocked

726
00:26:18,390 --> 00:26:16,240
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727
00:26:20,789 --> 00:26:18,400
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728
00:26:24,470 --> 00:26:20,799
is 41 and takes medication to control

729
00:26:27,750 --> 00:26:24,480
his cholesterol a 10-year 500 000 policy

730
00:26:29,830 --> 00:26:27,760
for under 26 a month that's almost twice

731
00:26:31,830 --> 00:26:29,840
the coverage for less than half of what

732
00:26:33,590 --> 00:26:31,840
he had paid if select quote hasn't

733
00:26:35,430 --> 00:26:33,600
shopped for your life insurance you're

734
00:26:40,630 --> 00:26:35,440
probably paying too much

735
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:44,789
that's 1-800-403-4885

736
00:26:44,799 --> 00:26:48,630
1-800-403-4885

737
00:26:53,909 --> 00:26:52,230
or go to selectquote.com we shop you

738
00:26:55,510 --> 00:26:53,919
save get full details in the example

739
00:26:56,470 --> 00:26:55,520
policy slow cook.com commercials your

740
00:26:57,669 --> 00:26:56,480
price could vary depending on your

741
00:27:01,269 --> 00:26:57,679
health issuing company and other factors

742
00:27:07,029 --> 00:27:04,149
hi this is don ecker and you are tuned

743
00:27:09,430 --> 00:27:07,039
in to the paracast let me tell you what

744
00:27:12,789 --> 00:27:09,440
you're gonna hear stuff here that you

745
00:27:15,430 --> 00:27:12,799
probably won't hear anywhere else hear

746
00:27:17,430 --> 00:27:15,440
that george snorri

747
00:27:20,149 --> 00:27:17,440
he's doing an echo i can do all sorts of

748
00:27:23,110 --> 00:27:20,159
crazy sounds too on this mixer but i

749
00:27:25,269 --> 00:27:23,120
choose not to you know it's hard enough

750
00:27:26,789 --> 00:27:25,279
for me the way it's adjusted to sound

751
00:27:28,630 --> 00:27:26,799
like a human being

752
00:27:31,830 --> 00:27:28,640
you know i really have to push that

753
00:27:35,029 --> 00:27:31,840
really difficult but i manage okay so

754
00:27:37,990 --> 00:27:35,039
we had a book i first became aware of

755
00:27:40,549 --> 00:27:38,000
30 40 years ago called they live in the

756
00:27:43,029 --> 00:27:40,559
sky and the author was trevor james

757
00:27:44,470 --> 00:27:43,039
constable accepted the book listed as

758
00:27:45,830 --> 00:27:44,480
trevor james

759
00:27:46,870 --> 00:27:45,840
which i guess he wanted to make a

760
00:27:50,549 --> 00:27:46,880
pseudonym

761
00:27:53,269 --> 00:27:50,559
he died recently his theory was that

762
00:27:55,669 --> 00:27:53,279
at least some ufos were like giant

763
00:27:57,830 --> 00:27:55,679
amoebas living creatures

764
00:27:59,909 --> 00:27:57,840
so what do you say about that i think

765
00:28:03,430 --> 00:27:59,919
it's a really interesting theory again i

766
00:28:05,350 --> 00:28:03,440
don't know how likely in my own personal

767
00:28:06,870 --> 00:28:05,360
estimation of the broader ufo phenomena

768
00:28:08,470 --> 00:28:06,880
it may be but i always find it

769
00:28:10,149 --> 00:28:08,480
interesting because trevor james

770
00:28:11,830 --> 00:28:10,159
constable was one of those characters

771
00:28:13,350 --> 00:28:11,840
early on who was

772
00:28:15,510 --> 00:28:13,360
someone who was trying to take i think

773
00:28:17,350 --> 00:28:15,520
kind of like keel and a number of others

774
00:28:19,269 --> 00:28:17,360
he was trying to take a kind of atypical

775
00:28:20,870 --> 00:28:19,279
approach to understanding phenomena he

776
00:28:22,710 --> 00:28:20,880
wasn't going to give himself to this

777
00:28:25,510 --> 00:28:22,720
idea that well i think therefore they

778
00:28:28,310 --> 00:28:25,520
must be aliens he was he was willing to

779
00:28:30,070 --> 00:28:28,320
entertain the idea that uh this may be

780
00:28:32,070 --> 00:28:30,080
some kind of terrestrial phenomena and

781
00:28:33,190 --> 00:28:32,080
as far out as i think he called them

782
00:28:35,590 --> 00:28:33,200
critters

783
00:28:38,310 --> 00:28:35,600
and as far out and as absurd in fact as

784
00:28:40,230 --> 00:28:38,320
that may seem i give constable credit

785
00:28:41,430 --> 00:28:40,240
for having at least tried to look for an

786
00:28:43,029 --> 00:28:41,440
earthly

787
00:28:44,310 --> 00:28:43,039
understanding of the phenomena before

788
00:28:45,990 --> 00:28:44,320
leaping to the conclusion that these

789
00:28:48,630 --> 00:28:46,000
must be extraterrestrial which your

790
00:28:51,269 --> 00:28:48,640
listeners of course know as do mine that

791
00:28:53,510 --> 00:28:51,279
this is not particularly an estimate of

792
00:28:55,430 --> 00:28:53,520
the situation as it were uh that i

793
00:28:56,950 --> 00:28:55,440
endorse as far as ufos go i just don't

794
00:28:59,110 --> 00:28:56,960
know that there's enough evidence that

795
00:29:01,830 --> 00:28:59,120
says we without question know we're

796
00:29:04,310 --> 00:29:01,840
dealing with e.t so constable kind of

797
00:29:06,230 --> 00:29:04,320
took that same approach too i actually

798
00:29:07,029 --> 00:29:06,240
this is kind of interesting i actually

799
00:29:09,430 --> 00:29:07,039
had

800
00:29:11,190 --> 00:29:09,440
an opportunity to interview trevor james

801
00:29:12,950 --> 00:29:11,200
constable a few years ago

802
00:29:14,710 --> 00:29:12,960
the book that i had become familiar with

803
00:29:16,230 --> 00:29:14,720
was not the one you mentioned i actually

804
00:29:19,350 --> 00:29:16,240
had read another one called the cosmic

805
00:29:21,830 --> 00:29:19,360
pulse of life and a friend of mine who

806
00:29:23,269 --> 00:29:21,840
is actually just as nerdy as i am about

807
00:29:25,430 --> 00:29:23,279
this sort of stuff

808
00:29:26,950 --> 00:29:25,440
his nerdiness about ufo subjects and

809
00:29:28,470 --> 00:29:26,960
similar things might rival mine and

810
00:29:30,149 --> 00:29:28,480
yours put together gene but vance

811
00:29:32,389 --> 00:29:30,159
pollock is his name and he had gotten a

812
00:29:33,990 --> 00:29:32,399
copy of the cosmic pulse of life because

813
00:29:36,789 --> 00:29:34,000
he's very interested in that era of

814
00:29:37,909 --> 00:29:36,799
ufology those 50s and 60s researchers

815
00:29:39,029 --> 00:29:37,919
and some of the interesting theories

816
00:29:40,710 --> 00:29:39,039
that were coming out and he had written

817
00:29:41,669 --> 00:29:40,720
to constable to see if he was still

818
00:29:43,830 --> 00:29:41,679
alive

819
00:29:46,149 --> 00:29:43,840
and if he might mail the book to him and

820
00:29:47,909 --> 00:29:46,159
have him sign it constable replied and

821
00:29:49,510 --> 00:29:47,919
said by all means yes and he

822
00:29:50,950 --> 00:29:49,520
actually signed the book for him and so

823
00:29:52,789 --> 00:29:50,960
vance approached me this was probably

824
00:29:54,230 --> 00:29:52,799
seven or eight years ago gene and he

825
00:29:55,750 --> 00:29:54,240
said you know you ought to get this guy

826
00:29:57,669 --> 00:29:55,760
on your show no one ever talks to him

827
00:29:59,510 --> 00:29:57,679
anymore and he was a really weird

828
00:30:01,190 --> 00:29:59,520
thinker as it relates to ufos early on

829
00:30:02,870 --> 00:30:01,200
and so i did i contacted him found an

830
00:30:04,789 --> 00:30:02,880
email for him online and he agreed to do

831
00:30:06,789 --> 00:30:04,799
an interview and he wanted to do three

832
00:30:08,389 --> 00:30:06,799
hours he said we have so much to discuss

833
00:30:09,909 --> 00:30:08,399
and it was kind of sad because

834
00:30:11,190 --> 00:30:09,919
i got the distinct impression that he

835
00:30:12,950 --> 00:30:11,200
didn't get to do many interviews he

836
00:30:13,990 --> 00:30:12,960
didn't he didn't feel that his theories

837
00:30:15,750 --> 00:30:14,000
were very

838
00:30:17,750 --> 00:30:15,760
taken very seriously i think in the

839
00:30:19,990 --> 00:30:17,760
modern ufo era and he hadn't had an

840
00:30:22,310 --> 00:30:20,000
opportunity to really first of all be

841
00:30:23,830 --> 00:30:22,320
approached by anyone let alone be

842
00:30:26,149 --> 00:30:23,840
offered an interview and i told him

843
00:30:27,909 --> 00:30:26,159
unfortunately we've only got an hour but

844
00:30:30,310 --> 00:30:27,919
i'd still like to have you on so i

845
00:30:31,750 --> 00:30:30,320
called him up and earlier in the that

846
00:30:34,389 --> 00:30:31,760
program that night i'd been filling in

847
00:30:35,990 --> 00:30:34,399
on a local radio station that i did a

848
00:30:37,909 --> 00:30:36,000
occasional guest hosting position on

849
00:30:39,909 --> 00:30:37,919
here in my hometown of asheville

850
00:30:41,669 --> 00:30:39,919
greg bishop of all people had been on

851
00:30:44,149 --> 00:30:41,679
the show in the first hour and i

852
00:30:45,990 --> 00:30:44,159
mentioned as we do in radio i teased who

853
00:30:47,750 --> 00:30:46,000
would be our guest in the second hour

854
00:30:49,110 --> 00:30:47,760
and greg said oh well he says you're

855
00:30:50,470 --> 00:30:49,120
lucky he says i've always wanted to talk

856
00:30:52,789 --> 00:30:50,480
to that guy i've never been able to find

857
00:30:54,710 --> 00:30:52,799
him and i said greg stick around and

858
00:30:56,549 --> 00:30:54,720
talk and so greg held on the line and

859
00:30:58,470 --> 00:30:56,559
from the telephone did what i'm doing

860
00:30:59,909 --> 00:30:58,480
with you today he did a guest co-hosting

861
00:31:01,590 --> 00:30:59,919
thing with me and we interviewed

862
00:31:03,110 --> 00:31:01,600
constable and it was really interesting

863
00:31:05,590 --> 00:31:03,120
talking with him because again here he

864
00:31:08,950 --> 00:31:05,600
was again a really kind of a maverick

865
00:31:10,630 --> 00:31:08,960
thinker for his day uh and and we we had

866
00:31:12,310 --> 00:31:10,640
this interesting talk so fast forward to

867
00:31:14,630 --> 00:31:12,320
the present i hadn't heard that he'd

868
00:31:16,549 --> 00:31:14,640
passed away as you just mentioned

869
00:31:18,389 --> 00:31:16,559
and it was none other than greg bishop

870
00:31:21,029 --> 00:31:18,399
who had posted about it online saying

871
00:31:23,190 --> 00:31:21,039
how we've lost another one and i wrote

872
00:31:24,389 --> 00:31:23,200
on the post that he made on facebook i

873
00:31:25,909 --> 00:31:24,399
said greg i'll try and find that

874
00:31:28,310 --> 00:31:25,919
interview we did and greg said wait what

875
00:31:30,070 --> 00:31:28,320
what interview greg didn't remember

876
00:31:32,230 --> 00:31:30,080
right off hand that we had spoken with

877
00:31:33,830 --> 00:31:32,240
trevor constable and so i couldn't find

878
00:31:35,029 --> 00:31:33,840
it in my archives and i posted online

879
00:31:36,870 --> 00:31:35,039
that i was trying to find it lo and

880
00:31:39,269 --> 00:31:36,880
behold here comes vance pollock again

881
00:31:41,669 --> 00:31:39,279
having seen my reply to greg's post and

882
00:31:43,269 --> 00:31:41,679
emails me the audio file which i now

883
00:31:45,750 --> 00:31:43,279
have back in my possession and so yeah

884
00:31:48,070 --> 00:31:45,760
it's rather interesting to look back now

885
00:31:50,310 --> 00:31:48,080
and uh even you know seven or eight

886
00:31:52,310 --> 00:31:50,320
years ago look at how my own ideas about

887
00:31:53,909 --> 00:31:52,320
this phenomena has changed let alone how

888
00:31:55,830 --> 00:31:53,919
much it has changed since trevor first

889
00:31:57,909 --> 00:31:55,840
proposed the idea of critters

890
00:31:59,509 --> 00:31:57,919
in the sky one final anecdote it did

891
00:32:00,950 --> 00:31:59,519
remind me of something gene

892
00:32:02,549 --> 00:32:00,960
there was a story i think written by

893
00:32:04,710 --> 00:32:02,559
arthur conan doyle

894
00:32:06,710 --> 00:32:04,720
probably in the latter part of the uh

895
00:32:08,870 --> 00:32:06,720
the 19th century called the horror of

896
00:32:11,029 --> 00:32:08,880
the heights are you familiar with it

897
00:32:14,149 --> 00:32:11,039
i don't think so why don't you tell us

898
00:32:16,470 --> 00:32:14,159
it was a short story that dole wrote

899
00:32:18,310 --> 00:32:16,480
which involved he got keep in mind that

900
00:32:19,990 --> 00:32:18,320
this is uh you know it may have actually

901
00:32:21,190 --> 00:32:20,000
dated to the early part of the 20th

902
00:32:22,870 --> 00:32:21,200
century because i know it involved

903
00:32:23,990 --> 00:32:22,880
airplanes so it actually may have been a

904
00:32:26,630 --> 00:32:24,000
later

905
00:32:29,430 --> 00:32:26,640
art story but in the story a pilot an

906
00:32:30,950 --> 00:32:29,440
intrepid pilot decides to ascend to an

907
00:32:31,990 --> 00:32:30,960
altitude that no other pilot had ever

908
00:32:33,430 --> 00:32:32,000
flown to

909
00:32:35,830 --> 00:32:33,440
and of course he was aware of the

910
00:32:37,909 --> 00:32:35,840
dangers that might arise from flying his

911
00:32:39,509 --> 00:32:37,919
plane so high but he was he was

912
00:32:42,710 --> 00:32:39,519
compelled kind of like the proverbial

913
00:32:44,630 --> 00:32:42,720
cat uh you know toward water or maybe an

914
00:32:46,710 --> 00:32:44,640
electrical outlet

915
00:32:49,029 --> 00:32:46,720
he flies higher and higher

916
00:32:51,190 --> 00:32:49,039
just to fulfill his curiosity and he

917
00:32:53,909 --> 00:32:51,200
gets to this altitude and when he gets

918
00:32:54,830 --> 00:32:53,919
up there there are these jellyfish like

919
00:32:57,509 --> 00:32:54,840
uh

920
00:32:59,190 --> 00:32:57,519
creatures that exist up in the in the

921
00:33:01,269 --> 00:32:59,200
upper reaches of the atmosphere that at

922
00:33:02,549 --> 00:33:01,279
that time in this story no human had

923
00:33:04,789 --> 00:33:02,559
ever reached

924
00:33:06,470 --> 00:33:04,799
and uh it was the earliest mention that

925
00:33:08,310 --> 00:33:06,480
i had found of

926
00:33:09,669 --> 00:33:08,320
once again another meme that we find

927
00:33:12,230 --> 00:33:09,679
that is rather pervasive throughout

928
00:33:14,630 --> 00:33:12,240
certain ufo literature which is the idea

929
00:33:16,950 --> 00:33:14,640
of flying jellyfish or ufos that

930
00:33:18,230 --> 00:33:16,960
resemble jellyfish or other kind of

931
00:33:20,149 --> 00:33:18,240
sea creatures

932
00:33:21,750 --> 00:33:20,159
so this was sort of similar i know ivan

933
00:33:23,269 --> 00:33:21,760
sanderson had talked about this kind of

934
00:33:25,750 --> 00:33:23,279
an idea just as well

935
00:33:27,909 --> 00:33:25,760
and uh and it was very reminiscent of

936
00:33:30,549 --> 00:33:27,919
what trevor constable had uh proposed

937
00:33:32,310 --> 00:33:30,559
with his critters these amoeba-like

938
00:33:34,549 --> 00:33:32,320
life forms that actually existed up in

939
00:33:37,029 --> 00:33:34,559
the sky

940
00:33:39,430 --> 00:33:37,039
that's what it is

941
00:33:41,590 --> 00:33:39,440
amoeba-like creatures but you know i

942
00:33:43,590 --> 00:33:41,600
mentioned this very briefly and i don't

943
00:33:45,430 --> 00:33:43,600
i don't know if you remember this

944
00:33:46,630 --> 00:33:45,440
there was a sci-fi tv show kind of a

945
00:33:48,389 --> 00:33:46,640
cult show

946
00:33:50,230 --> 00:33:48,399
that went on the sci-fi channel called

947
00:33:51,509 --> 00:33:50,240
farscape

948
00:33:53,669 --> 00:33:51,519
you remember it

949
00:33:57,110 --> 00:33:53,679
i do remember it although i i regret to

950
00:34:00,149 --> 00:33:57,120
say i have not uh pursued watching it uh

951
00:34:03,750 --> 00:34:00,159
as i should but i think it is on netflix

952
00:34:04,830 --> 00:34:03,760
okay so it's about this guy who

953
00:34:07,350 --> 00:34:04,840
takes a

954
00:34:09,430 --> 00:34:07,360
spaceship a spacecraft kind of a

955
00:34:11,990 --> 00:34:09,440
primitive one an astronaut

956
00:34:13,909 --> 00:34:12,000
and he gets caught in a wormhole

957
00:34:18,310 --> 00:34:13,919
as transported to the other side of the

958
00:34:19,589 --> 00:34:18,320
universe in a place populated by a few

959
00:34:21,430 --> 00:34:19,599
muppets

960
00:34:24,389 --> 00:34:21,440
because the son of jim henson was one of

961
00:34:26,869 --> 00:34:24,399
the producers but it turned out that the

962
00:34:31,829 --> 00:34:26,879
spaceships they used were all

963
00:34:34,470 --> 00:34:33,669
that's pretty interesting

964
00:34:39,190 --> 00:34:34,480
living

965
00:34:41,270 --> 00:34:39,200
i could make a a whovian reference here

966
00:34:43,190 --> 00:34:41,280
that i think it was the fifth series of

967
00:34:44,550 --> 00:34:43,200
uh doctor who since the relaunch which

968
00:34:46,310 --> 00:34:44,560
would have been the first series

969
00:34:49,030 --> 00:34:46,320
starring actor matt smith playing the

970
00:34:50,230 --> 00:34:49,040
role of the 11th doctor there is a

971
00:34:51,990 --> 00:34:50,240
uh city

972
00:34:54,790 --> 00:34:52,000
that the doctor and his new companion

973
00:34:57,430 --> 00:34:54,800
amy pond visit in which the city is is

974
00:34:59,750 --> 00:34:57,440
is traversing space on the back of a

975
00:35:01,910 --> 00:34:59,760
space whale it's literally a large uh

976
00:35:03,750 --> 00:35:01,920
blue whale-like creature that's flying

977
00:35:05,750 --> 00:35:03,760
through space and it's being controlled

978
00:35:07,589 --> 00:35:05,760
against its will

979
00:35:09,750 --> 00:35:07,599
kind of an interesting concept but yeah

980
00:35:11,030 --> 00:35:09,760
you do see that again pretty prevalent

981
00:35:12,630 --> 00:35:11,040
in various

982
00:35:15,510 --> 00:35:12,640
sci-fi literature

983
00:35:17,109 --> 00:35:15,520
this idea of of an organic or a

984
00:35:18,790 --> 00:35:17,119
semi-organic

985
00:35:21,270 --> 00:35:18,800
uh component

986
00:35:23,109 --> 00:35:21,280
within the actual spacecraft and not

987
00:35:24,790 --> 00:35:23,119
just again a sentience like artificially

988
00:35:26,230 --> 00:35:24,800
intelligent spacecraft and things like

989
00:35:28,150 --> 00:35:26,240
this when we're talking about an actual

990
00:35:30,870 --> 00:35:28,160
biological organism

991
00:35:32,470 --> 00:35:30,880
that is that is uh you know tasked with

992
00:35:34,390 --> 00:35:32,480
propelling one through space so that's

993
00:35:35,589 --> 00:35:34,400
kind of an interesting thing um there

994
00:35:37,750 --> 00:35:35,599
was sort of

995
00:35:39,829 --> 00:35:37,760
a bit of that motif i noticed that came

996
00:35:41,190 --> 00:35:39,839
about in uh the film based on travis

997
00:35:43,670 --> 00:35:41,200
walton's uh

998
00:35:46,870 --> 00:35:43,680
hair-raising encounter with the ufo

999
00:35:48,630 --> 00:35:46,880
fire in the sky of course travis is very

1000
00:35:49,990 --> 00:35:48,640
outspoken about the differences between

1001
00:35:52,150 --> 00:35:50,000
his experience and what appeared in that

1002
00:35:54,310 --> 00:35:52,160
movie it was very much a hollywood

1003
00:35:55,990 --> 00:35:54,320
rendition but in the film the interior

1004
00:35:56,950 --> 00:35:56,000
of the spaceship for those who remember

1005
00:35:59,349 --> 00:35:56,960
the movie

1006
00:36:01,190 --> 00:35:59,359
had a very kind of an organic feel to it

1007
00:36:03,829 --> 00:36:01,200
it was almost more like he had gone into

1008
00:36:06,470 --> 00:36:03,839
some sort of a weird slimy cave rather

1009
00:36:08,790 --> 00:36:06,480
than the interior of a flying saucer

1010
00:36:09,910 --> 00:36:08,800
that one might expect

1011
00:36:11,270 --> 00:36:09,920
now

1012
00:36:14,150 --> 00:36:11,280
just one thing

1013
00:36:17,109 --> 00:36:14,160
in addition that is a peculiar side

1014
00:36:18,630 --> 00:36:17,119
aspect of trevor jane's constable

1015
00:36:20,310 --> 00:36:18,640
that when they were

1016
00:36:22,790 --> 00:36:20,320
putting together material for a

1017
00:36:24,470 --> 00:36:22,800
follow-up book to flying saucers and the

1018
00:36:26,310 --> 00:36:24,480
three men

1019
00:36:28,230 --> 00:36:26,320
trevor james constable was one of the

1020
00:36:30,790 --> 00:36:28,240
people who wrote

1021
00:36:33,109 --> 00:36:30,800
a piece a letter that was included

1022
00:36:35,589 --> 00:36:33,119
so did he have a particular interest in

1023
00:36:38,069 --> 00:36:35,599
the kind of experiences that bender had

1024
00:36:40,470 --> 00:36:38,079
let's find out more in our next segment

1025
00:36:42,790 --> 00:36:40,480
we've got micah hanks

1026
00:36:49,300 --> 00:36:42,800
so it's gene and micah you're in the

1027
00:36:52,829 --> 00:36:50,390
[Applause]

1028
00:36:56,660 --> 00:36:52,839
thank you for listening to

1029
00:36:58,950 --> 00:36:56,670
gcn be sure to visit gcnlive.com today

1030
00:37:00,870 --> 00:36:58,960
[Music]

1031
00:37:02,950 --> 00:37:00,880
conspiracy journal is your number one

1032
00:37:04,790 --> 00:37:02,960
source for the hidden world of the weird

1033
00:37:06,390 --> 00:37:04,800
and strange we bring you

1034
00:37:08,790 --> 00:37:06,400
thought-provoking and controversial

1035
00:37:11,190 --> 00:37:08,800
material for free thinking individuals

1036
00:37:13,829 --> 00:37:11,200
who are seeking what is really going on

1037
00:37:16,390 --> 00:37:13,839
in our world today some of this material

1038
00:37:18,870 --> 00:37:16,400
may adversely affect you other pieces

1039
00:37:21,190 --> 00:37:18,880
are meant to enlighten either way be

1040
00:37:25,349 --> 00:37:21,200
prepared to be intrigued by such things

1041
00:37:27,589 --> 00:37:25,359
as the reality of ufos ghosts strange

1042
00:37:31,190 --> 00:37:27,599
creatures from time and space hidden

1043
00:37:33,430 --> 00:37:31,200
conspiracies time travel nikola tesla

1044
00:37:34,230 --> 00:37:33,440
suppressed technology and a whole lot

1045
00:37:40,310 --> 00:37:34,240
more

1046
00:37:42,550 --> 00:37:40,320
website at conspiracyjournal.com

1047
00:37:45,109 --> 00:37:42,560
there you can sign up for our free

1048
00:37:46,550 --> 00:37:45,119
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1049
00:37:49,510 --> 00:37:46,560
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1050
00:37:57,589 --> 00:37:49,520
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1051
00:38:02,470 --> 00:37:59,910
by now you know that wireless technology

1052
00:38:04,550 --> 00:38:02,480
like cell phones do in fact pose dangers

1053
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1054
00:38:08,069 --> 00:38:06,720
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1055
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1056
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1057
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1058
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1059
00:38:20,390 --> 00:38:17,839
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1060
00:38:23,790 --> 00:38:20,400
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1061
00:38:26,150 --> 00:38:23,800
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1062
00:38:27,349 --> 00:38:26,160
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1063
00:38:28,950 --> 00:38:27,359
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1064
00:38:30,470 --> 00:38:28,960
dr joel wallach here if you're a baby

1065
00:38:32,069 --> 00:38:30,480
boomer and you're worried about the big

1066
00:38:33,910 --> 00:38:32,079
epidemics coming and i'm not talking

1067
00:38:35,670 --> 00:38:33,920
about the bird flu or the swine flu i'm

1068
00:38:37,670 --> 00:38:35,680
talking about epidemics of alzheimer's

1069
00:38:39,829 --> 00:38:37,680
disease heart disease obesity diabetes

1070
00:38:41,270 --> 00:38:39,839
arthritis cancer that's because the 80

1071
00:38:43,270 --> 00:38:41,280
million baby boomers followed all the

1072
00:38:45,270 --> 00:38:43,280
advice of doctors and oh houston we have

1073
00:38:47,910 --> 00:38:45,280
a problem see dr wallock live in

1074
00:38:52,030 --> 00:38:47,920
farmington new mexico thursday may 12th

1075
00:39:00,069 --> 00:38:54,870
www.cdockinfarmington.com that's www.c

1076
00:39:03,270 --> 00:39:01,510
is rick ossick president of famous

1077
00:39:04,790 --> 00:39:03,280
footwear our company is working together

1078
00:39:06,710 --> 00:39:04,800
with the march of dimes through march

1079
00:39:08,630 --> 00:39:06,720
for babies to raise money and awareness

1080
00:39:11,109 --> 00:39:08,640
about the serious problem of premature

1081
00:39:13,109 --> 00:39:11,119
birth in the u.s as a business leader i

1082
00:39:15,190 --> 00:39:13,119
know that babies born very sick or too

1083
00:39:16,710 --> 00:39:15,200
soon cost businesses billions of dollars

1084
00:39:18,550 --> 00:39:16,720
each year in addition to the emotional

1085
00:39:20,310 --> 00:39:18,560
stress on employees and their families

1086
00:39:21,990 --> 00:39:20,320
that's why famous footwear is committed

1087
00:39:24,150 --> 00:39:22,000
to raising funds to improve the health

1088
00:39:25,990 --> 00:39:24,160
of moms and babies everywhere won't you

1089
00:39:29,670 --> 00:39:26,000
please join us in the march for babies

1090
00:39:31,990 --> 00:39:29,680
start a team today at marchforbabies.org

1091
00:39:34,310 --> 00:39:32,000
this is it for the first time ever on

1092
00:39:37,589 --> 00:39:34,320
this station u.s government gold offered

1093
00:39:39,589 --> 00:39:37,599
at cost for only 139 each with wall

1094
00:39:41,109 --> 00:39:39,599
street suffering its worst start to a

1095
00:39:42,550 --> 00:39:41,119
trading year in history now is

1096
00:39:44,790 --> 00:39:42,560
especially the time to be paying

1097
00:39:47,430 --> 00:39:44,800
attention to gold this first time ever

1098
00:39:50,230 --> 00:39:47,440
us legal tender government gold offered

1099
00:39:52,390 --> 00:39:50,240
at cost for only 139 dollars each is

1100
00:39:55,109 --> 00:39:52,400
from the us money reserve call them at

1101
00:39:57,510 --> 00:39:55,119
1-866-944-gold

1102
00:39:59,430 --> 00:39:57,520
gold is on the move so don't miss out

1103
00:40:01,910 --> 00:39:59,440
for the first time ever on this station

1104
00:40:07,109 --> 00:40:01,920
u.s government gold offered at cost for

1105
00:40:10,870 --> 00:40:08,829
or online at

1106
00:40:13,349 --> 00:40:10,880
usmoneyreserve.com ask for a free

1107
00:40:15,270 --> 00:40:13,359
55-page gold buyer's book plus get a

1108
00:40:17,109 --> 00:40:15,280
free walking liberty half dollar just

1109
00:40:19,430 --> 00:40:17,119
for reading this must-have book get your

1110
00:40:21,990 --> 00:40:19,440
free gold book your free half dollar but

1111
00:40:23,109 --> 00:40:22,000
most importantly get your gold at cost

1112
00:40:25,270 --> 00:40:23,119
for only

1113
00:40:29,190 --> 00:40:25,280
thirty nine dollars per coin one eight

1114
00:40:30,310 --> 00:40:29,200
six six nine four four g o l d

1115
00:40:31,349 --> 00:40:30,320
paid an attorney spokesperson adam

1116
00:40:32,390 --> 00:40:31,359
poliski of the palestinian law firm with

1117
00:40:33,270 --> 00:40:32,400
principal office and used to taxes the

1118
00:40:34,390 --> 00:40:33,280
attorney responsible for the content of

1119
00:40:35,109 --> 00:40:34,400
this ad this ad is not legal advice and

1120
00:40:36,310 --> 00:40:35,119
the choice of a lawyer should not be

1121
00:40:37,589 --> 00:40:36,320
based only on advertisement services may

1122
00:40:39,750 --> 00:40:37,599
not be available in all states attention

1123
00:40:41,589 --> 00:40:39,760
zarato users if you or a loved one took

1124
00:40:43,270 --> 00:40:41,599
xarelto and suffered a serious bleeding

1125
00:40:45,270 --> 00:40:43,280
event you may be entitled to financial

1126
00:40:46,470 --> 00:40:45,280
compensation xaroto is a popular

1127
00:40:48,150 --> 00:40:46,480
prescription blood thinner used to

1128
00:40:49,510 --> 00:40:48,160
prevent blood clots and protect patients

1129
00:40:50,950 --> 00:40:49,520
from strokes these serious bleeding

1130
00:40:52,710 --> 00:40:50,960
events have led to numerous cases of

1131
00:40:55,309 --> 00:40:52,720
hospitalization and even death phone

1132
00:41:01,170 --> 00:40:55,319
lines are open 24 7. call

1133
00:41:07,910 --> 00:41:06,150
[Music]

1134
00:41:09,430 --> 00:41:07,920
it's grant cameron from presidential

1135
00:41:11,829 --> 00:41:09,440
ufo.com

1136
00:41:19,750 --> 00:41:11,839
you're listening to the peracast the

1137
00:41:24,390 --> 00:41:21,750
he is searching for his inner gut to

1138
00:41:26,069 --> 00:41:24,400
find more voices to use

1139
00:41:27,829 --> 00:41:26,079
and eventually he'll actually find one

1140
00:41:29,990 --> 00:41:27,839
that works i'm just kidding i didn't

1141
00:41:32,230 --> 00:41:30,000
mean that i really didn't mean that

1142
00:41:33,750 --> 00:41:32,240
honest engine didn't mean it didn't mean

1143
00:41:35,589 --> 00:41:33,760
it not at all all right so we were

1144
00:41:39,990 --> 00:41:35,599
talking about trevor james constable and

1145
00:41:43,270 --> 00:41:40,000
his viewpoints about some ufos being

1146
00:41:44,230 --> 00:41:43,280
amoeba-like creatures large

1147
00:41:49,510 --> 00:41:44,240
now

1148
00:41:50,790 --> 00:41:49,520
did look into this as a serious

1149
00:41:52,630 --> 00:41:50,800
possibility

1150
00:41:55,109 --> 00:41:52,640
anyone else or is he kind of one of

1151
00:41:57,670 --> 00:41:55,119
these obscure characters in the ufo

1152
00:42:00,870 --> 00:41:57,680
field with interesting theories but they

1153
00:42:03,190 --> 00:42:00,880
just really never gain serious traction

1154
00:42:06,069 --> 00:42:03,200
you know unfortunately i i kind of view

1155
00:42:07,750 --> 00:42:06,079
constable as being the latter when i

1156
00:42:09,910 --> 00:42:07,760
spoke with him and i'll never forget

1157
00:42:12,230 --> 00:42:09,920
this gene he he uh

1158
00:42:14,630 --> 00:42:12,240
he had a sort of a commanding presence

1159
00:42:16,069 --> 00:42:14,640
he had a certain way of speaking you

1160
00:42:19,670 --> 00:42:16,079
know there was this this roundness and

1161
00:42:21,349 --> 00:42:19,680
almost a regal sound to his voice

1162
00:42:23,190 --> 00:42:21,359
and it really kind of gave one the

1163
00:42:25,510 --> 00:42:23,200
impression that this was a man who was i

1164
00:42:27,190 --> 00:42:25,520
mean he was the way that the regal sound

1165
00:42:28,630 --> 00:42:27,200
carried over in his voice i imagined him

1166
00:42:29,910 --> 00:42:28,640
as being this sort of an aristocratic

1167
00:42:31,990 --> 00:42:29,920
character you know with a scarf about

1168
00:42:34,630 --> 00:42:32,000
his neck you know and lounging back and

1169
00:42:37,430 --> 00:42:34,640
talking he he just had a very you know a

1170
00:42:39,109 --> 00:42:37,440
very uh interesting presence about him

1171
00:42:41,190 --> 00:42:39,119
uh and it was sad because i think that

1172
00:42:42,790 --> 00:42:41,200
although he accepted it gracefully he he

1173
00:42:44,470 --> 00:42:42,800
felt that you know his ideas kind of

1174
00:42:46,630 --> 00:42:44,480
fall into the wayside over the years

1175
00:42:48,390 --> 00:42:46,640
especially with the proliferation

1176
00:42:51,349 --> 00:42:48,400
of the ever-present extraterrestrial

1177
00:42:52,710 --> 00:42:51,359
interpretation of ufos now again

1178
00:42:55,349 --> 00:42:52,720
i'll be clear in saying that i don't

1179
00:42:57,589 --> 00:42:55,359
endorse constables theory any more than

1180
00:42:59,349 --> 00:42:57,599
i endorse the idea of extraterrestrial

1181
00:43:01,270 --> 00:42:59,359
visitation i think maybe we could say

1182
00:43:03,270 --> 00:43:01,280
that either could be a possibility

1183
00:43:04,950 --> 00:43:03,280
however remote they may seem

1184
00:43:07,510 --> 00:43:04,960
uh and and the reason i would even say

1185
00:43:09,510 --> 00:43:07,520
that is because although you know

1186
00:43:11,270 --> 00:43:09,520
i think constable

1187
00:43:12,390 --> 00:43:11,280
again kind of

1188
00:43:14,230 --> 00:43:12,400
he presented like

1189
00:43:15,190 --> 00:43:14,240
very unusual looking photographs i

1190
00:43:16,230 --> 00:43:15,200
remember

1191
00:43:17,829 --> 00:43:16,240
some of the pictures that were in the

1192
00:43:19,589 --> 00:43:17,839
book the cosmic pulse of life of these

1193
00:43:21,109 --> 00:43:19,599
purported critters they looked to me

1194
00:43:23,030 --> 00:43:21,119
very reminiscent

1195
00:43:25,430 --> 00:43:23,040
of what you know paranormal enthusiasts

1196
00:43:26,710 --> 00:43:25,440
today would call maybe orbs or something

1197
00:43:28,550 --> 00:43:26,720
along those lines

1198
00:43:30,309 --> 00:43:28,560
um it seemed that he was looking at the

1199
00:43:32,790 --> 00:43:30,319
same sort of phenomena and interpreting

1200
00:43:34,069 --> 00:43:32,800
it through i guess that ufological lens

1201
00:43:36,470 --> 00:43:34,079
at that time

1202
00:43:37,430 --> 00:43:36,480
for me while i wouldn't say that i

1203
00:43:39,030 --> 00:43:37,440
literally think that there are these

1204
00:43:41,030 --> 00:43:39,040
amoeba-like creatures coming down you

1205
00:43:42,630 --> 00:43:41,040
know from the the super sargasso sea

1206
00:43:44,390 --> 00:43:42,640
that charles fort envisioned and they're

1207
00:43:46,630 --> 00:43:44,400
coming swooping down and stealing cattle

1208
00:43:48,470 --> 00:43:46,640
and things like that i think trevor very

1209
00:43:50,550 --> 00:43:48,480
literally may have actually thought that

1210
00:43:53,270 --> 00:43:50,560
but you know nasa did a um

1211
00:43:54,950 --> 00:43:53,280
an interesting study about uh

1212
00:43:56,230 --> 00:43:54,960
maybe five or six years ago may have

1213
00:43:57,829 --> 00:43:56,240
been earlier

1214
00:43:58,950 --> 00:43:57,839
and you can still find this online i

1215
00:44:02,309 --> 00:43:58,960
should try and find it link in the

1216
00:44:04,230 --> 00:44:02,319
paracast forums but um this study had

1217
00:44:06,309 --> 00:44:04,240
involved the idea of what some call

1218
00:44:08,150 --> 00:44:06,319
energy zoa or you know some sort of a

1219
00:44:10,950 --> 00:44:08,160
plasma based life that might spring to

1220
00:44:13,190 --> 00:44:10,960
life from within the vacuum of space

1221
00:44:14,550 --> 00:44:13,200
and nasa had certainly in at least

1222
00:44:16,390 --> 00:44:14,560
entertained the possibility that there

1223
00:44:18,790 --> 00:44:16,400
may be energetic life forms which are

1224
00:44:20,390 --> 00:44:18,800
not life as we would expect it to

1225
00:44:22,230 --> 00:44:20,400
manifest here on earth but that might

1226
00:44:25,349 --> 00:44:22,240
exist in other reaches of space and i've

1227
00:44:26,710 --> 00:44:25,359
heard some anecdotal information about

1228
00:44:29,030 --> 00:44:26,720
those involved with the space program

1229
00:44:31,750 --> 00:44:29,040
perhaps even astronauts describing

1230
00:44:32,790 --> 00:44:31,760
infrared anomalies that appeared to

1231
00:44:35,030 --> 00:44:32,800
resemble

1232
00:44:36,870 --> 00:44:35,040
well once again amoeba-like though much

1233
00:44:38,790 --> 00:44:36,880
smaller than constable would have

1234
00:44:40,550 --> 00:44:38,800
envisioned but amoeba-like

1235
00:44:42,550 --> 00:44:40,560
structures sometimes

1236
00:44:43,589 --> 00:44:42,560
visible only in the infrared now again

1237
00:44:45,030 --> 00:44:43,599
i'd have to be able to find some

1238
00:44:46,470 --> 00:44:45,040
supporting literature for that you know

1239
00:44:47,910 --> 00:44:46,480
this is anecdotal information that was

1240
00:44:49,589 --> 00:44:47,920
passed along to me a number of years ago

1241
00:44:51,670 --> 00:44:49,599
by a colleague

1242
00:44:53,190 --> 00:44:51,680
but whatever the case may be i do think

1243
00:44:56,309 --> 00:44:53,200
that there have been some realistic

1244
00:44:57,910 --> 00:44:56,319
interpretations and hypotheses presented

1245
00:45:00,309 --> 00:44:57,920
by the space program you know by

1246
00:45:01,750 --> 00:45:00,319
exobiologists and by others in the

1247
00:45:04,550 --> 00:45:01,760
scientific community that it very least

1248
00:45:06,390 --> 00:45:04,560
did bear you know market similarity to

1249
00:45:08,550 --> 00:45:06,400
constables theories but you know again i

1250
00:45:09,990 --> 00:45:08,560
don't think that as he envisioned them

1251
00:45:12,550 --> 00:45:10,000
and especially as they related to a

1252
00:45:13,910 --> 00:45:12,560
possible explanation for ufos i don't

1253
00:45:15,670 --> 00:45:13,920
think that they were able to maintain

1254
00:45:17,430 --> 00:45:15,680
their ground throughout the decades and

1255
00:45:19,109 --> 00:45:17,440
you know my discussion with him years

1256
00:45:21,109 --> 00:45:19,119
ago was that of a man who i think was a

1257
00:45:22,870 --> 00:45:21,119
little disenfranchised with

1258
00:45:24,390 --> 00:45:22,880
where his theories had fallen and how

1259
00:45:27,349 --> 00:45:24,400
they'd more importantly fallen out of

1260
00:45:29,589 --> 00:45:27,359
favor uh with the passing of time

1261
00:45:31,589 --> 00:45:29,599
so in general this guy was thought of as

1262
00:45:33,750 --> 00:45:31,599
being a bit of a crank

1263
00:45:36,550 --> 00:45:33,760
to most people of course they think a

1264
00:45:37,589 --> 00:45:36,560
lot worse of me so don't take that in

1265
00:45:39,349 --> 00:45:37,599
any way

1266
00:45:42,309 --> 00:45:39,359
ah well i haven't seen that but you know

1267
00:45:44,550 --> 00:45:42,319
i guess we all have our critics don't we

1268
00:45:46,790 --> 00:45:44,560
i shouldn't wish to say

1269
00:45:49,349 --> 00:45:46,800
well i will say this though that uh

1270
00:45:51,829 --> 00:45:49,359
to me trevor might have been seen as a

1271
00:45:54,390 --> 00:45:51,839
crank but again i i give him the credit

1272
00:45:56,710 --> 00:45:54,400
of being a person who to the best of his

1273
00:45:59,750 --> 00:45:56,720
ability he was trying to think outside

1274
00:46:01,829 --> 00:45:59,760
of the typical ufo paradigm and although

1275
00:46:03,990 --> 00:46:01,839
it led him down a different path uh it

1276
00:46:06,710 --> 00:46:04,000
was again as in in some ways very

1277
00:46:08,630 --> 00:46:06,720
similar to what john keel had talked

1278
00:46:10,390 --> 00:46:08,640
about it was very similar to some of the

1279
00:46:12,150 --> 00:46:10,400
ideas even that have been proposed by

1280
00:46:15,030 --> 00:46:12,160
jacques valet you know is there

1281
00:46:16,870 --> 00:46:15,040
something that is far more localized in

1282
00:46:19,109 --> 00:46:16,880
terms of the ufo presence rather than

1283
00:46:21,109 --> 00:46:19,119
being the extraterrestrial phenomena

1284
00:46:22,550 --> 00:46:21,119
that many take it to be

1285
00:46:24,550 --> 00:46:22,560
and it is interesting because there are

1286
00:46:25,910 --> 00:46:24,560
such a variety of interpretations and i

1287
00:46:27,349 --> 00:46:25,920
think that really where people like

1288
00:46:29,510 --> 00:46:27,359
constable may be

1289
00:46:31,030 --> 00:46:29,520
aired in their interpretation was that

1290
00:46:32,309 --> 00:46:31,040
while they were they were clever enough

1291
00:46:34,150 --> 00:46:32,319
to say you know

1292
00:46:35,829 --> 00:46:34,160
do we really have enough evidence that

1293
00:46:37,190 --> 00:46:35,839
suggests e.t

1294
00:46:39,829 --> 00:46:37,200
is what we're dealing with when we talk

1295
00:46:41,910 --> 00:46:39,839
about ufos i think he had gone as many

1296
00:46:43,990 --> 00:46:41,920
researchers tend to do he'd gone a

1297
00:46:46,230 --> 00:46:44,000
little too far in one direction or

1298
00:46:48,950 --> 00:46:46,240
another with regard to his own

1299
00:46:51,270 --> 00:46:48,960
uh hypotheticals his own theorizing and

1300
00:46:53,109 --> 00:46:51,280
it's okay to theorize but i'll tell you

1301
00:46:54,710 --> 00:46:53,119
gene i've gone to a few ufo uh

1302
00:46:57,829 --> 00:46:54,720
conferences here over the last couple of

1303
00:47:00,069 --> 00:46:57,839
months and i'm a bit shocked frankly

1304
00:47:02,550 --> 00:47:00,079
when i attend these lectures how some of

1305
00:47:05,349 --> 00:47:02,560
the bigger names in the field uh engage

1306
00:47:07,270 --> 00:47:05,359
in this almost endless speculation

1307
00:47:09,270 --> 00:47:07,280
and from speaker to speaker to speaker

1308
00:47:10,710 --> 00:47:09,280
it's always different from one person to

1309
00:47:12,309 --> 00:47:10,720
the next this person says the entire

1310
00:47:13,829 --> 00:47:12,319
thing's et and then it's a cover-up this

1311
00:47:15,430 --> 00:47:13,839
person thinks that these et time

1312
00:47:17,750 --> 00:47:15,440
travelers from the future who are also

1313
00:47:19,510 --> 00:47:17,760
symbiotic you know you know or maintain

1314
00:47:20,950 --> 00:47:19,520
symbiotic relationships with artificial

1315
00:47:22,550 --> 00:47:20,960
intelligence or they themselves are the

1316
00:47:25,270 --> 00:47:22,560
artificial intelligence created by

1317
00:47:26,950 --> 00:47:25,280
somebody long time ago in a galaxy far

1318
00:47:29,750 --> 00:47:26,960
away you know there's endless

1319
00:47:31,990 --> 00:47:29,760
speculation about the ufo subject um

1320
00:47:33,270 --> 00:47:32,000
where my own personal interpretation

1321
00:47:34,710 --> 00:47:33,280
although i know we've been jumping

1322
00:47:37,349 --> 00:47:34,720
springboarding off the heels of

1323
00:47:38,950 --> 00:47:37,359
discussion about constable but i i think

1324
00:47:40,630 --> 00:47:38,960
that it's important

1325
00:47:42,150 --> 00:47:40,640
that and this is where my own mind has

1326
00:47:43,910 --> 00:47:42,160
tended to go more and more in the last

1327
00:47:45,910 --> 00:47:43,920
couple of years it's important to be

1328
00:47:47,990 --> 00:47:45,920
able to recognize what we can say with

1329
00:47:49,510 --> 00:47:48,000
certainty about ufos and unfortunately

1330
00:47:51,109 --> 00:47:49,520
the majority of what we read in books

1331
00:47:53,510 --> 00:47:51,119
and we see in lectures these days is

1332
00:47:55,030 --> 00:47:53,520
based on a lot of speculation there may

1333
00:47:56,710 --> 00:47:55,040
be some good evidence

1334
00:47:58,790 --> 00:47:56,720
for something but i think that you know

1335
00:48:00,390 --> 00:47:58,800
what what we see is researchers will

1336
00:48:02,150 --> 00:48:00,400
they'll find information they'll follow

1337
00:48:05,270 --> 00:48:02,160
lines of thought they'll find a new

1338
00:48:06,870 --> 00:48:05,280
thread they'll employ this possibility

1339
00:48:08,950 --> 00:48:06,880
is a line of thought and it really takes

1340
00:48:10,630 --> 00:48:08,960
them off down into this realm of being

1341
00:48:12,069 --> 00:48:10,640
so speculative that really i mean it

1342
00:48:13,349 --> 00:48:12,079
starts sounding a lot more like fantasy

1343
00:48:15,430 --> 00:48:13,359
than really what we know we're dealing

1344
00:48:17,270 --> 00:48:15,440
with which is merely one thing if there

1345
00:48:19,430 --> 00:48:17,280
are apparently objects seen in the sky

1346
00:48:21,510 --> 00:48:19,440
some of them appear to be intelligently

1347
00:48:23,589 --> 00:48:21,520
controlled some of them appear to be

1348
00:48:25,990 --> 00:48:23,599
constructed objects or some sort of

1349
00:48:27,829 --> 00:48:26,000
aircraft structured objects as it were

1350
00:48:29,990 --> 00:48:27,839
you know some people do still although

1351
00:48:31,829 --> 00:48:30,000
we have to point out to a much lesser

1352
00:48:34,630 --> 00:48:31,839
degree i think in the last few years

1353
00:48:36,230 --> 00:48:34,640
than it once was decades ago but to some

1354
00:48:38,390 --> 00:48:36,240
significant degree some people claim

1355
00:48:39,750 --> 00:48:38,400
that there appears to be a presence

1356
00:48:41,349 --> 00:48:39,760
associated with these craft and some

1357
00:48:43,030 --> 00:48:41,359
even claim to have had interactions with

1358
00:48:44,309 --> 00:48:43,040
the operators so make of it what you

1359
00:48:46,309 --> 00:48:44,319
will but really beyond that i don't

1360
00:48:48,390 --> 00:48:46,319
think that in terms of good

1361
00:48:50,230 --> 00:48:48,400
undeniable evidence we have very much

1362
00:48:51,109 --> 00:48:50,240
more to deal with and my skeptic friends

1363
00:48:53,430 --> 00:48:51,119
now

1364
00:48:55,190 --> 00:48:53,440
the ones who are skeptical enough but

1365
00:48:56,870 --> 00:48:55,200
also open-minded enough to want to

1366
00:48:57,990 --> 00:48:56,880
engage in discussions with people like

1367
00:49:02,069 --> 00:48:58,000
myself

1368
00:49:04,309 --> 00:49:02,079
but we often discuss this sort of thing

1369
00:49:06,069 --> 00:49:04,319
and say really how much hard evidence

1370
00:49:08,549 --> 00:49:06,079
and what really kind of good verifiable

1371
00:49:10,470 --> 00:49:08,559
proof do we have i think that's why ufos

1372
00:49:12,470 --> 00:49:10,480
remain so perplexing and maybe why there

1373
00:49:13,990 --> 00:49:12,480
is so much speculation whether it be

1374
00:49:15,510 --> 00:49:14,000
critters in the sky or you know time

1375
00:49:18,390 --> 00:49:15,520
travelers from the future or aliens

1376
00:49:20,950 --> 00:49:18,400
whatever is that the lack of evidence

1377
00:49:22,390 --> 00:49:20,960
has helped foment imagination and with

1378
00:49:24,470 --> 00:49:22,400
ufos we have to understand and

1379
00:49:26,470 --> 00:49:24,480
differentiate between the good evidence

1380
00:49:28,390 --> 00:49:26,480
and the imaginary components

1381
00:49:30,390 --> 00:49:28,400
there you go all right let's leave

1382
00:49:31,910 --> 00:49:30,400
trevor james constable

1383
00:49:34,309 --> 00:49:31,920
and what he did

1384
00:49:36,069 --> 00:49:34,319
i suppose this is a kind of theory that

1385
00:49:38,470 --> 00:49:36,079
could be brought up again

1386
00:49:40,950 --> 00:49:38,480
but what about in general in the ufo

1387
00:49:42,950 --> 00:49:40,960
field there's a feeling on the part of

1388
00:49:45,750 --> 00:49:42,960
many of us that

1389
00:49:47,990 --> 00:49:45,760
there aren't any great breakthroughs

1390
00:49:49,990 --> 00:49:48,000
being made in research i mean we kind of

1391
00:49:53,589 --> 00:49:50,000
are doing the same thing we did in the

1392
00:49:55,750 --> 00:49:53,599
50s looking for spaceships except for

1393
00:49:56,870 --> 00:49:55,760
you know people who go into

1394
00:49:59,910 --> 00:49:56,880
some more

1395
00:50:01,910 --> 00:49:59,920
involved theories such as from john keel

1396
00:50:03,829 --> 00:50:01,920
and of course from

1397
00:50:04,790 --> 00:50:03,839
trevor james constable and that sort of

1398
00:50:07,109 --> 00:50:04,800
thing

1399
00:50:08,870 --> 00:50:07,119
and we have about a 40 seconds before we

1400
00:50:09,990 --> 00:50:08,880
have to split for

1401
00:50:11,510 --> 00:50:10,000
our break

1402
00:50:13,109 --> 00:50:11,520
so i'm going to ask you briefly you can

1403
00:50:14,549 --> 00:50:13,119
start here and i know you can never be

1404
00:50:19,270 --> 00:50:14,559
brief

1405
00:50:21,910 --> 00:50:19,280
someone's contributing anything

1406
00:50:23,190 --> 00:50:21,920
significant towards ufo research

1407
00:50:25,349 --> 00:50:23,200
i certainly think that there are a few

1408
00:50:26,390 --> 00:50:25,359
people you know uh ray stanford comes to

1409
00:50:28,069 --> 00:50:26,400
mind i think that some of the

1410
00:50:30,150 --> 00:50:28,079
investigative research of guys like nick

1411
00:50:31,349 --> 00:50:30,160
pope is also very worthwhile right now

1412
00:50:33,270 --> 00:50:31,359
but when we come back from the break we

1413
00:50:35,349 --> 00:50:33,280
can get into i think maybe rather than

1414
00:50:37,510 --> 00:50:35,359
those who are doing what maybe needs to

1415
00:50:39,190 --> 00:50:37,520
be done in order to present a more

1416
00:50:41,589 --> 00:50:39,200
scientific view of ufology for the

1417
00:50:43,190 --> 00:50:41,599
future all right i'll go for that

1418
00:50:45,510 --> 00:50:43,200
let's take a look and consider that

1419
00:50:48,150 --> 00:50:45,520
further but let me first consider this

1420
00:50:50,390 --> 00:50:48,160
we have another radio show that we do

1421
00:50:51,190 --> 00:50:50,400
every week called after the paracast

1422
00:50:52,870 --> 00:50:51,200
it's

1423
00:50:55,270 --> 00:50:52,880
a show that has

1424
00:50:57,750 --> 00:50:55,280
color commentary kind of a wrap-up show

1425
00:50:59,910 --> 00:50:57,760
sometimes we start an interview on the

1426
00:51:01,510 --> 00:50:59,920
power cast we run out of time because

1427
00:51:03,190 --> 00:51:01,520
it's a network radio show and you can't

1428
00:51:05,910 --> 00:51:03,200
say give me 10 more minutes

1429
00:51:08,230 --> 00:51:05,920
the time is the time we continue it and

1430
00:51:11,190 --> 00:51:08,240
after the power cast and the only way to

1431
00:51:12,470 --> 00:51:11,200
get that show is to sign up for the

1432
00:51:15,470 --> 00:51:12,480
powercast plus go to

1433
00:51:18,470 --> 00:51:15,480
plus.thepowercast.com

1434
00:51:20,790 --> 00:51:18,480
plus.powercast.com we recently cut our

1435
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long-term subscription rates so sign up

1436
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now before they go back up

1437
00:51:27,829 --> 00:51:25,680
plus.theparacast.com we also offer the

1438
00:51:29,990 --> 00:51:27,839
ad-free version of this show with higher

1439
00:51:32,870 --> 00:51:30,000
quality audio chris o'brien's on

1440
00:51:38,790 --> 00:51:32,880
walkabout with gene and micah you're in

1441
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:43,510
thank you for listening to gcn

1442
00:51:48,069 --> 00:51:44,430
visit

1443
00:51:52,390 --> 00:51:50,069
attack of the rockoids has been well

1444
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received by critics and readers alike

1445
00:51:55,430 --> 00:51:54,000
it's a thrill a minute story you'll

1446
00:51:57,349 --> 00:51:55,440
never forget

1447
00:51:59,829 --> 00:51:57,359
a former u.s military intelligence

1448
00:52:02,390 --> 00:51:59,839
officer is haunted by intense dreams

1449
00:52:04,710 --> 00:52:02,400
about a beautiful woman pleading for his

1450
00:52:05,829 --> 00:52:04,720
help after a terrible battle in outer

1451
00:52:07,990 --> 00:52:05,839
space

1452
00:52:09,910 --> 00:52:08,000
but the dreams turn out to be true and

1453
00:52:12,630 --> 00:52:09,920
thrust him into a telepathic love affair

1454
00:52:15,109 --> 00:52:12,640
with a woman whose far away planet is

1455
00:52:17,510 --> 00:52:15,119
intent on destroying the earth

1456
00:52:20,069 --> 00:52:17,520
and now the gripping tale continues in

1457
00:52:22,630 --> 00:52:20,079
the coming of the protectors it's the

1458
00:52:24,790 --> 00:52:22,640
second book of the rockoids trilogy a

1459
00:52:27,109 --> 00:52:24,800
galaxy spanning adventure that pits our

1460
00:52:29,349 --> 00:52:27,119
hapless heroes against powerful

1461
00:52:31,270 --> 00:52:29,359
fanatical enemies that threaten the

1462
00:52:32,390 --> 00:52:31,280
lives of freedom-loving beings

1463
00:52:35,109 --> 00:52:32,400
everywhere

1464
00:52:38,069 --> 00:52:35,119
attack of the rockoids and the coming of

1465
00:52:40,549 --> 00:52:38,079
the protectors classic science fiction

1466
00:52:43,750 --> 00:52:40,559
at its best available now

1467
00:52:46,630 --> 00:52:43,760
for more details visit rockoids.com

1468
00:52:49,670 --> 00:52:46,640
that's r o c k r-o-c-k-o-i-d-s

1469
00:52:55,109 --> 00:52:52,150
how would you like to make 17 on your

1470
00:52:57,990 --> 00:52:55,119
money in only 90 days that's right gold

1471
00:53:00,390 --> 00:52:58,000
owners made 17 in only three months as

1472
00:53:02,710 --> 00:53:00,400
gold had its best quarterly gain in 30

1473
00:53:04,790 --> 00:53:02,720
years gold is on the move and you need

1474
00:53:08,069 --> 00:53:04,800
to get government-issued legal tender

1475
00:53:10,150 --> 00:53:08,079
gold coins starting at only 139

1476
00:53:12,150 --> 00:53:10,160
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1477
00:53:14,470 --> 00:53:12,160
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1478
00:53:17,430 --> 00:53:14,480
announces the first ever at cost gold

1479
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release on this station for only 139

1480
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or online at

1481
00:53:26,790 --> 00:53:24,800
usmoneyreserve.com official u.s

1482
00:53:30,309 --> 00:53:26,800
government issued legal tender solid

1483
00:53:34,069 --> 00:53:30,319
gold coins at cost for only 139 dollars

1484
00:53:39,270 --> 00:53:37,190
ask for a free 55-page gold buyers book

1485
00:53:41,190 --> 00:53:39,280
plus get a free walking liberty half

1486
00:53:43,510 --> 00:53:41,200
dollar just for reading this must-have

1487
00:53:51,860 --> 00:53:43,520
book all about gold remember gold is on

1488
00:53:51,870 --> 00:53:56,630
[Applause]

1489
00:54:03,510 --> 00:53:59,829
welcome back to the paracast the gold

1490
00:54:04,790 --> 00:54:03,520
standard of paranormal radio

1491
00:54:08,100 --> 00:54:04,800
and now

1492
00:54:11,990 --> 00:54:08,110
here's jane steinberg

1493
00:54:17,030 --> 00:54:14,230
so we continue our discussion with micah

1494
00:54:18,950 --> 00:54:17,040
hanks who is serving as guest and guest

1495
00:54:20,790 --> 00:54:18,960
co-host this week as chris o'brien's on

1496
00:54:23,430 --> 00:54:20,800
walkabout so

1497
00:54:24,390 --> 00:54:23,440
you started in response to my question

1498
00:54:26,710 --> 00:54:24,400
about

1499
00:54:29,109 --> 00:54:26,720
the major contributions being made

1500
00:54:30,950 --> 00:54:29,119
particularly more recently in the ufo

1501
00:54:33,750 --> 00:54:30,960
field where would you want to take that

1502
00:54:35,270 --> 00:54:33,760
well let's take it back a few decades

1503
00:54:37,670 --> 00:54:35,280
today it's not that there aren't

1504
00:54:38,470 --> 00:54:37,680
researchers who are really contributing

1505
00:54:39,589 --> 00:54:38,480
a lot

1506
00:54:40,950 --> 00:54:39,599
and i think that there would be people

1507
00:54:42,309 --> 00:54:40,960
let's be very fair because i think

1508
00:54:43,750 --> 00:54:42,319
before we can be critical of others we

1509
00:54:46,069 --> 00:54:43,760
have to be critical of ourselves and

1510
00:54:47,349 --> 00:54:46,079
understand our own shortcomings there

1511
00:54:48,870 --> 00:54:47,359
are many days

1512
00:54:50,710 --> 00:54:48,880
and and this has been happening a lot

1513
00:54:51,829 --> 00:54:50,720
lately where i've despite all that i've

1514
00:54:53,109 --> 00:54:51,839
tried to do

1515
00:54:55,109 --> 00:54:53,119
with my own

1516
00:54:57,109 --> 00:54:55,119
assessment of the phenomena my own

1517
00:54:58,790 --> 00:54:57,119
urgings to the community that these are

1518
00:55:00,870 --> 00:54:58,800
things that should have to change in

1519
00:55:03,190 --> 00:55:00,880
order to really be able to get back to

1520
00:55:05,349 --> 00:55:03,200
brass tacks on how we're studying ufos

1521
00:55:07,349 --> 00:55:05,359
um i still find gene that i wake up and

1522
00:55:09,670 --> 00:55:07,359
i'll say is what i'm doing really

1523
00:55:11,270 --> 00:55:09,680
worthwhile am i really doing anything do

1524
00:55:13,349 --> 00:55:11,280
i should i go to the national archives

1525
00:55:14,710 --> 00:55:13,359
like stanton friedman has done and start

1526
00:55:16,150 --> 00:55:14,720
looking for new information should i

1527
00:55:17,589 --> 00:55:16,160
start you know following freedom of

1528
00:55:19,829 --> 00:55:17,599
information act requests like nick

1529
00:55:21,190 --> 00:55:19,839
redfern does and try and find new

1530
00:55:22,790 --> 00:55:21,200
information i know that there are some

1531
00:55:24,790 --> 00:55:22,800
researchers including john burroughs who

1532
00:55:27,030 --> 00:55:24,800
i spoke to recently uh when we were at a

1533
00:55:28,710 --> 00:55:27,040
conference together in eureka springs

1534
00:55:30,870 --> 00:55:28,720
he seems to be i think making some very

1535
00:55:32,870 --> 00:55:30,880
interesting headway with the freedom of

1536
00:55:35,510 --> 00:55:32,880
information act requests but i began to

1537
00:55:36,870 --> 00:55:35,520
think about this and this is by the way

1538
00:55:39,349 --> 00:55:36,880
no criticism of john by the way because

1539
00:55:41,109 --> 00:55:39,359
we had a great conversation um

1540
00:55:42,390 --> 00:55:41,119
but but i do think that

1541
00:55:43,990 --> 00:55:42,400
one of the fundamental issues that i've

1542
00:55:46,950 --> 00:55:44,000
begun to see

1543
00:55:49,030 --> 00:55:46,960
is when we talk about ufology

1544
00:55:51,910 --> 00:55:49,040
really the basic definition of what

1545
00:55:53,750 --> 00:55:51,920
ufology is is an attempt at trying to

1546
00:55:55,670 --> 00:55:53,760
study scientifically

1547
00:55:57,589 --> 00:55:55,680
claims of unidentified flying objects

1548
00:55:59,910 --> 00:55:57,599
and other aerial phenomena

1549
00:56:01,510 --> 00:55:59,920
and uh and i think that as we progress

1550
00:56:03,910 --> 00:56:01,520
through time

1551
00:56:06,309 --> 00:56:03,920
we've begun to see the utilization of

1552
00:56:08,390 --> 00:56:06,319
this similar but very different term uap

1553
00:56:10,230 --> 00:56:08,400
as opposed to ufo and a friend of mine

1554
00:56:11,589 --> 00:56:10,240
jason bradley one of my skeptic friends

1555
00:56:12,710 --> 00:56:11,599
that had written recently asked he said

1556
00:56:14,230 --> 00:56:12,720
i don't have a problem with that but i

1557
00:56:17,190 --> 00:56:14,240
was just curious as to why i've seen you

1558
00:56:18,950 --> 00:56:17,200
employing that term variously as opposed

1559
00:56:20,470 --> 00:56:18,960
to ufo do you think that it brings more

1560
00:56:22,470 --> 00:56:20,480
merit to the subject or something along

1561
00:56:23,990 --> 00:56:22,480
those lines and frankly i don't know

1562
00:56:25,510 --> 00:56:24,000
that it brings any more merit i merely

1563
00:56:27,510 --> 00:56:25,520
think that uap

1564
00:56:30,069 --> 00:56:27,520
unexplained aerial phenomena as opposed

1565
00:56:32,549 --> 00:56:30,079
to an unidentified flying object uap

1566
00:56:34,710 --> 00:56:32,559
seems to be as many would say a bit more

1567
00:56:36,950 --> 00:56:34,720
inclusive of phenomena that may not be

1568
00:56:38,309 --> 00:56:36,960
structured mechanical intelligently

1569
00:56:39,910 --> 00:56:38,319
controlled objects i think that there

1570
00:56:41,990 --> 00:56:39,920
are a wide variety

1571
00:56:44,309 --> 00:56:42,000
of aerial phenomena that constitute the

1572
00:56:46,069 --> 00:56:44,319
broader collection of ufo reports that

1573
00:56:47,270 --> 00:56:46,079
include earthquake lights geophysical

1574
00:56:49,750 --> 00:56:47,280
phenomena

1575
00:56:51,670 --> 00:56:49,760
lightning

1576
00:56:53,270 --> 00:56:51,680
and there may be other things too

1577
00:56:55,190 --> 00:56:53,280
which a radiative phenomena that

1578
00:56:56,789 --> 00:56:55,200
actually comes from some place far far

1579
00:56:59,670 --> 00:56:56,799
away but nonetheless which might present

1580
00:57:02,309 --> 00:56:59,680
an illumination observable in the sky

1581
00:57:04,150 --> 00:57:02,319
which our current knowledge does not

1582
00:57:05,430 --> 00:57:04,160
completely account for to give a brief

1583
00:57:07,109 --> 00:57:05,440
example of what i mean there are

1584
00:57:09,190 --> 00:57:07,119
radiative bursts that sometimes are

1585
00:57:11,270 --> 00:57:09,200
called sky flashes and i'm not talking

1586
00:57:12,789 --> 00:57:11,280
about these flashes that like lightning

1587
00:57:14,390 --> 00:57:12,799
but in the absence of thunder that light

1588
00:57:15,990 --> 00:57:14,400
up the entire sky i'm talking about on a

1589
00:57:17,910 --> 00:57:16,000
clear night points of light that

1590
00:57:19,829 --> 00:57:17,920
suddenly appear and then disappear in

1591
00:57:21,190 --> 00:57:19,839
the night sky they aren't moving we're

1592
00:57:23,270 --> 00:57:21,200
not talking about something like a

1593
00:57:25,270 --> 00:57:23,280
satellite or a bit of space debris we're

1594
00:57:27,349 --> 00:57:25,280
reflecting light we're talking about a

1595
00:57:29,750 --> 00:57:27,359
sudden radiative burst from some place

1596
00:57:32,150 --> 00:57:29,760
in deep space i've actually observed

1597
00:57:34,710 --> 00:57:32,160
these on two occasions myself and became

1598
00:57:36,230 --> 00:57:34,720
curious enough because of my background

1599
00:57:38,710 --> 00:57:36,240
i've got a lot of experience gene as an

1600
00:57:40,230 --> 00:57:38,720
amateur studying the night sky guys like

1601
00:57:41,829 --> 00:57:40,240
phil plate who actually i like his

1602
00:57:43,510 --> 00:57:41,839
writing as an astronomer but in

1603
00:57:45,030 --> 00:57:43,520
astronomy magazine a couple of years ago

1604
00:57:47,190 --> 00:57:45,040
about how people who believe in ufos

1605
00:57:49,349 --> 00:57:47,200
don't look up no that's not true i spend

1606
00:57:50,789 --> 00:57:49,359
a lot of time and every night that it's

1607
00:57:52,950 --> 00:57:50,799
clear and the weather's favorable

1608
00:57:54,789 --> 00:57:52,960
outside in my backyard with a telescope

1609
00:57:56,230 --> 00:57:54,799
if i can when you spend a lot of time

1610
00:57:57,670 --> 00:57:56,240
studying the sky you do see a lot of

1611
00:57:59,670 --> 00:57:57,680
interesting things i've seen you know

1612
00:58:01,190 --> 00:57:59,680
satellites debris the international

1613
00:58:02,710 --> 00:58:01,200
space station at probably its very

1614
00:58:04,150 --> 00:58:02,720
brightest of course meteors and other

1615
00:58:06,390 --> 00:58:04,160
things like this iridium flares

1616
00:58:08,230 --> 00:58:06,400
reflecting sometimes extremely bright

1617
00:58:09,270 --> 00:58:08,240
light back at earth there are a variety

1618
00:58:11,190 --> 00:58:09,280
of things that once you become

1619
00:58:12,950 --> 00:58:11,200
accustomed to seeing you can watch other

1620
00:58:14,150 --> 00:58:12,960
videos like those of stephen greer and

1621
00:58:16,150 --> 00:58:14,160
people who go out there as i have

1622
00:58:18,470 --> 00:58:16,160
jokingly said before they sing kumbaya

1623
00:58:20,950 --> 00:58:18,480
and meditate and try and call ufos i've

1624
00:58:22,630 --> 00:58:20,960
watched them film iridium flares i've

1625
00:58:25,430 --> 00:58:22,640
watched them film bioluminescent

1626
00:58:27,190 --> 00:58:25,440
plankton at the ocean with infrared uh

1627
00:58:29,270 --> 00:58:27,200
cameras i've watched them film all kinds

1628
00:58:31,829 --> 00:58:29,280
of very easily explainable natural

1629
00:58:33,910 --> 00:58:31,839
phenomena and call these ufo contacts

1630
00:58:36,470 --> 00:58:33,920
and it's quite laughable very laughable

1631
00:58:38,549 --> 00:58:36,480
in fact now that said these radiative

1632
00:58:40,230 --> 00:58:38,559
bursts that i've observed i was curious

1633
00:58:42,150 --> 00:58:40,240
enough with what i'd seen that i wanted

1634
00:58:44,950 --> 00:58:42,160
to know okay well what could this be and

1635
00:58:46,390 --> 00:58:44,960
i referred to the scientific literature

1636
00:58:47,829 --> 00:58:46,400
specifically i was able to find

1637
00:58:50,470 --> 00:58:47,839
something in the collected data by

1638
00:58:52,390 --> 00:58:50,480
william r corliss and certainly enough

1639
00:58:55,030 --> 00:58:52,400
there was a article that appeared in the

1640
00:58:57,030 --> 00:58:55,040
science journal about these sky flashes

1641
00:58:58,870 --> 00:58:57,040
that naked eye astronomers had described

1642
00:59:01,190 --> 00:58:58,880
seeing which interestingly infrared

1643
00:59:02,470 --> 00:59:01,200
equipment and telescopes had not seen

1644
00:59:04,950 --> 00:59:02,480
though they were pointed in the same

1645
00:59:06,950 --> 00:59:04,960
general region of the sky so there are

1646
00:59:08,630 --> 00:59:06,960
you know elements that that are present

1647
00:59:09,910 --> 00:59:08,640
in the scientific literature that and

1648
00:59:11,109 --> 00:59:09,920
even science articles that are

1649
00:59:13,190 --> 00:59:11,119
peer-reviewed that talk about this

1650
00:59:14,230 --> 00:59:13,200
phenomena so as we can see there are a

1651
00:59:16,470 --> 00:59:14,240
lot of different things that may

1652
00:59:18,230 --> 00:59:16,480
constitute natural phenomena that i

1653
00:59:20,470 --> 00:59:18,240
think still fall into the category of

1654
00:59:23,349 --> 00:59:20,480
weird lights and and phenomena seen in

1655
00:59:25,109 --> 00:59:23,359
the sky so uap i think covers that basis

1656
00:59:26,549 --> 00:59:25,119
a little better but

1657
00:59:27,829 --> 00:59:26,559
in the broader sense of things i still

1658
00:59:29,589 --> 00:59:27,839
find problems with when we're talking

1659
00:59:31,190 --> 00:59:29,599
about what appear to be intelligently

1660
00:59:33,829 --> 00:59:31,200
controlled

1661
00:59:35,750 --> 00:59:33,839
structured objects as far as ufos we've

1662
00:59:38,230 --> 00:59:35,760
got a lot of issues first of all like

1663
00:59:40,549 --> 00:59:38,240
we've addressed already gene many modern

1664
00:59:42,150 --> 00:59:40,559
researchers they don't really seek to

1665
00:59:43,910 --> 00:59:42,160
try and get down to the nitty gritty

1666
00:59:46,069 --> 00:59:43,920
details and understand what kind of

1667
00:59:48,390 --> 00:59:46,079
things in the sky might constitute ufo

1668
00:59:49,829 --> 00:59:48,400
reports they really i think ufology

1669
00:59:51,990 --> 00:59:49,839
rather than being scientific study of

1670
00:59:54,549 --> 00:59:52,000
this phenomena has become more and more

1671
00:59:56,950 --> 00:59:54,559
a political movement that seeks to try

1672
00:59:58,630 --> 00:59:56,960
and garner information by

1673
01:00:00,549 --> 00:59:58,640
pressing government for details and

1674
01:00:03,190 --> 01:00:00,559
pushing for this so-called

1675
01:00:04,549 --> 01:00:03,200
disclosure and this is very important

1676
01:00:05,990 --> 01:00:04,559
because

1677
01:00:07,109 --> 01:00:06,000
rather than scientific study of the

1678
01:00:09,030 --> 01:00:07,119
phenomena

1679
01:00:11,109 --> 01:00:09,040
the political movement with its

1680
01:00:13,349 --> 01:00:11,119
over-reliance on government eventually

1681
01:00:15,430 --> 01:00:13,359
releasing details about ufos

1682
01:00:17,829 --> 01:00:15,440
actually i think gene may present uh

1683
01:00:19,910 --> 01:00:17,839
some dangers i really do i think it's a

1684
01:00:22,230 --> 01:00:19,920
cop-out i think when you say well the

1685
01:00:24,630 --> 01:00:22,240
government knows it so that means in

1686
01:00:27,190 --> 01:00:24,640
effect we don't have to do anything

1687
01:00:29,270 --> 01:00:27,200
except well we assume they're spaceships

1688
01:00:31,510 --> 01:00:29,280
but since the government knows just make

1689
01:00:33,670 --> 01:00:31,520
them tell us and we can go home and go

1690
01:00:35,750 --> 01:00:33,680
to bed or whatever it is

1691
01:00:37,510 --> 01:00:35,760
you hit the nail on the head my friend

1692
01:00:38,950 --> 01:00:37,520
as i knew you would by the way

1693
01:00:41,109 --> 01:00:38,960
so i've been hitting a lot of things in

1694
01:00:43,910 --> 01:00:41,119
my head lately because i'm thinking i

1695
01:00:45,910 --> 01:00:43,920
might knock some sense into myself

1696
01:00:47,030 --> 01:00:45,920
i think you already have though gene uh

1697
01:00:49,030 --> 01:00:47,040
and it seemed to have happened a long

1698
01:00:50,470 --> 01:00:49,040
time ago to say it every time i come on

1699
01:00:51,670 --> 01:00:50,480
the show and i'll say it at least once

1700
01:00:53,430 --> 01:00:51,680
here that this is one of the shows i

1701
01:00:55,109 --> 01:00:53,440
enjoy listening to one of the few

1702
01:00:57,349 --> 01:00:55,119
podcasts that in the time that i have i

1703
01:00:59,190 --> 01:00:57,359
do try to tune into because of the kind

1704
01:01:01,030 --> 01:00:59,200
of sense that you guys attempt to make

1705
01:01:03,030 --> 01:01:01,040
of this and the serious discussions that

1706
01:01:04,950 --> 01:01:03,040
are had but that said what you just

1707
01:01:05,990 --> 01:01:04,960
pointed out the cop out as it relates to

1708
01:01:08,069 --> 01:01:06,000
disclosure

1709
01:01:10,150 --> 01:01:08,079
even if it is well intended the problems

1710
01:01:11,430 --> 01:01:10,160
that disclosure presents are as follows

1711
01:01:14,470 --> 01:01:11,440
and i can really narrow this down to two

1712
01:01:16,549 --> 01:01:14,480
points people may in their effort to

1713
01:01:18,309 --> 01:01:16,559
understand the phenomena and the social

1714
01:01:19,910 --> 01:01:18,319
movements that have been built around

1715
01:01:21,349 --> 01:01:19,920
the ideologies over time in other words

1716
01:01:22,789 --> 01:01:21,359
when i cringe when i hear people say the

1717
01:01:24,870 --> 01:01:22,799
ufo movement we got to get people

1718
01:01:27,030 --> 01:01:24,880
mobilized within this movement and get

1719
01:01:28,630 --> 01:01:27,040
you know really pressure our politicians

1720
01:01:30,710 --> 01:01:28,640
and get them to release this information

1721
01:01:31,910 --> 01:01:30,720
well when we hear that the problem is

1722
01:01:33,510 --> 01:01:31,920
that you know yeah there is a movement

1723
01:01:36,309 --> 01:01:33,520
built around ufos and what is the

1724
01:01:38,870 --> 01:01:36,319
predominant belief within that so-called

1725
01:01:39,990 --> 01:01:38,880
movement that e.t is visiting and that

1726
01:01:41,270 --> 01:01:40,000
the government knows this and that

1727
01:01:42,870 --> 01:01:41,280
they've maybe worked with them dwight

1728
01:01:44,549 --> 01:01:42,880
eisenhower went and met with them and

1729
01:01:46,950 --> 01:01:44,559
that this is being withheld by the

1730
01:01:49,270 --> 01:01:46,960
government now is there a shred of hard

1731
01:01:50,789 --> 01:01:49,280
evidence any decent proof that would you

1732
01:01:52,950 --> 01:01:50,799
know again satisfy a biologist a

1733
01:01:56,150 --> 01:01:52,960
physicist a chemist that seems to

1734
01:01:57,430 --> 01:01:56,160
substantiate that belief no if

1735
01:01:59,910 --> 01:01:57,440
let us presume

1736
01:02:01,990 --> 01:01:59,920
that is indeed a mythology that has been

1737
01:02:03,670 --> 01:02:02,000
built around the broader study of some

1738
01:02:06,549 --> 01:02:03,680
tangible phenomena which constitutes

1739
01:02:08,390 --> 01:02:06,559
actual ufos if that belief ended up

1740
01:02:09,990 --> 01:02:08,400
being unsubstantiated

1741
01:02:11,910 --> 01:02:10,000
but people's belief in it enough was

1742
01:02:13,670 --> 01:02:11,920
great so that they would go to

1743
01:02:15,510 --> 01:02:13,680
government and persistently request this

1744
01:02:17,190 --> 01:02:15,520
information if the data doesn't exist we

1745
01:02:19,670 --> 01:02:17,200
are wasting our time by asking for it

1746
01:02:21,430 --> 01:02:19,680
conversely let's presume that it is true

1747
01:02:23,430 --> 01:02:21,440
it's all true let's say that there was a

1748
01:02:26,230 --> 01:02:23,440
saucer recovered from roswell new mexico

1749
01:02:27,349 --> 01:02:26,240
in 1947 alien bodies were retrieved

1750
01:02:28,789 --> 01:02:27,359
they've been back engineering these

1751
01:02:31,030 --> 01:02:28,799
things out there at area 51 let's say

1752
01:02:33,430 --> 01:02:31,040
the whole thing bob lazar all these

1753
01:02:34,789 --> 01:02:33,440
people they're dead on it's all true

1754
01:02:36,789 --> 01:02:34,799
let's say that this is indeed the

1755
01:02:38,230 --> 01:02:36,799
greatest secret known to humankind which

1756
01:02:40,710 --> 01:02:38,240
is the very reason it is not known and

1757
01:02:42,230 --> 01:02:40,720
it's kept from the public any level of

1758
01:02:44,789 --> 01:02:42,240
disclosure that people might hope to

1759
01:02:46,870 --> 01:02:44,799
attain through political uh bodies

1760
01:02:48,230 --> 01:02:46,880
governing bodies you know it is

1761
01:02:49,670 --> 01:02:48,240
something that has not been released and

1762
01:02:51,990 --> 01:02:49,680
then likelihood in the united states

1763
01:02:53,829 --> 01:02:52,000
probably wouldn't and if we lobby to

1764
01:02:55,510 --> 01:02:53,839
government you know this so-called truth

1765
01:02:57,190 --> 01:02:55,520
embargo that some people talk about i'm

1766
01:02:59,109 --> 01:02:57,200
just not convinced that if something of

1767
01:03:01,030 --> 01:02:59,119
that magnitude existed that we would

1768
01:03:02,950 --> 01:03:01,040
necessarily obtain it through political

1769
01:03:05,109 --> 01:03:02,960
action so the the shortcomings of

1770
01:03:07,430 --> 01:03:05,119
disclosure are that if nothing exists

1771
01:03:09,030 --> 01:03:07,440
we're wasting our time and we may we may

1772
01:03:10,710 --> 01:03:09,040
very well be wasting our time if

1773
01:03:12,549 --> 01:03:10,720
something does exist because we can't

1774
01:03:14,390 --> 01:03:12,559
give ourselves to this hopeful notion

1775
01:03:16,069 --> 01:03:14,400
that it's just going to be released by

1776
01:03:17,829 --> 01:03:16,079
government so i say that either way you

1777
01:03:19,910 --> 01:03:17,839
look at it really to me there's a strong

1778
01:03:21,829 --> 01:03:19,920
case to be made for independent civilian

1779
01:03:24,230 --> 01:03:21,839
research that is scientifically minded

1780
01:03:26,390 --> 01:03:24,240
that seeks to study ufos in connection

1781
01:03:28,950 --> 01:03:26,400
with that i'm going to ask you about

1782
01:03:31,270 --> 01:03:28,960
the classification system for ufos which

1783
01:03:33,109 --> 01:03:31,280
go back to the days of dr j allen

1784
01:03:34,549 --> 01:03:33,119
heineck and maybe they need to be

1785
01:03:36,150 --> 01:03:34,559
changed lots of things need to be

1786
01:03:37,670 --> 01:03:36,160
changed but what doesn't have to be

1787
01:03:40,069 --> 01:03:37,680
changed is the fact that we have micah

1788
01:03:42,390 --> 01:03:40,079
hanks with us of the grealian report

1789
01:03:47,589 --> 01:03:42,400
with gene and micah you're in the

1790
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1801
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1802
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1803
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1804
01:04:25,750 --> 01:04:23,599
coming of the protectors a former

1805
01:04:28,150 --> 01:04:25,760
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1806
01:04:30,630 --> 01:04:28,160
by a space woman in a dream a dream that

1807
01:04:32,150 --> 01:04:30,640
turns out to be a nightmare because evil

1808
01:04:34,390 --> 01:04:32,160
forces on her distant planet are

1809
01:04:36,710 --> 01:04:34,400
planning to conquer the earth this is

1810
01:04:38,950 --> 01:04:36,720
gripping science fiction of the classic

1811
01:04:41,109 --> 01:04:38,960
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1812
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1813
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1814
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1818
01:04:58,789 --> 01:04:57,280
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1819
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1820
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1821
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1822
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1825
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1826
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1827
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1828
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1832
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1833
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1834
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1835
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1836
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1837
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1838
01:06:16,470 --> 01:06:12,400
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1839
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1840
01:06:22,390 --> 01:06:20,319
or go to gcnteam.com this is it for the

1841
01:06:24,750 --> 01:06:22,400
first time ever on this station u.s

1842
01:06:27,910 --> 01:06:24,760
government gold offered at cost for only

1843
01:06:29,990 --> 01:06:27,920
139 each with wall street suffering its

1844
01:06:31,829 --> 01:06:30,000
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1845
01:06:34,150 --> 01:06:31,839
now is especially the time to be paying

1846
01:06:36,789 --> 01:06:34,160
attention to gold this first time ever

1847
01:06:39,510 --> 01:06:36,799
us legal tender government gold offered

1848
01:06:41,910 --> 01:06:39,520
at cost for only 139 dollars each is

1849
01:06:45,990 --> 01:06:41,920
from the us money reserve call them at 1

1850
01:06:47,910 --> 01:06:46,000
866 944 gold gold is on the move so

1851
01:06:49,990 --> 01:06:47,920
don't miss out for the first time ever

1852
01:06:53,349 --> 01:06:50,000
on this station u.s government gold

1853
01:06:56,390 --> 01:06:53,359
offered at cost for only 139 each

1854
01:07:00,150 --> 01:06:58,109
or online at

1855
01:07:02,630 --> 01:07:00,160
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1856
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1858
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1859
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1860
01:07:13,990 --> 01:07:11,359
most importantly get your gold at cost

1861
01:07:18,549 --> 01:07:14,000
for only 139 dollars per coin

1862
01:07:21,109 --> 01:07:19,750
so you've got to take a state

1863
01:07:23,190 --> 01:07:21,119
construction license exam or

1864
01:07:25,190 --> 01:07:23,200
certification can't decide on what books

1865
01:07:27,270 --> 01:07:25,200
or what chapters to study discover right

1866
01:07:29,190 --> 01:07:27,280
now how you can eliminate unnecessary

1867
01:07:30,870 --> 01:07:29,200
books and wasted study time at

1868
01:07:33,109 --> 01:07:30,880
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1869
01:07:35,190 --> 01:07:33,119
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1870
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1871
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1872
01:07:41,789 --> 01:07:39,440
a plumber electrician general contractor

1873
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1874
01:07:46,670 --> 01:07:43,599
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1875
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1876
01:07:55,670 --> 01:07:53,270
we'd like to hear from you if you have a

1877
01:07:59,270 --> 01:07:55,680
comment or question about the paracast

1878
01:08:02,549 --> 01:07:59,280
send it to news at theparecast.com

1879
01:08:04,390 --> 01:08:02,559
that's news at theparacast.com

1880
01:08:06,870 --> 01:08:04,400
and don't forget to visit our famous

1881
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paracast community forums at

1882
01:08:16,149 --> 01:08:14,549
so micah hanks the classification system

1883
01:08:17,829 --> 01:08:16,159
for ufos

1884
01:08:20,709 --> 01:08:17,839
tell us more you know when we talk about

1885
01:08:22,309 --> 01:08:20,719
classification systems for ufos uh i

1886
01:08:24,550 --> 01:08:22,319
want to first of all go back to the

1887
01:08:26,309 --> 01:08:24,560
literature and explain what we mean

1888
01:08:28,950 --> 01:08:26,319
you know who is really making

1889
01:08:30,470 --> 01:08:28,960
uh headway with the ufo subject today

1890
01:08:31,829 --> 01:08:30,480
and the problem i guess we begin to see

1891
01:08:33,510 --> 01:08:31,839
is really that although there are many

1892
01:08:35,590 --> 01:08:33,520
people who are very

1893
01:08:38,149 --> 01:08:35,600
knowledgeable and and very intelligent

1894
01:08:40,390 --> 01:08:38,159
in their investigations the so-called

1895
01:08:41,990 --> 01:08:40,400
scientific effort to study ufos has

1896
01:08:44,470 --> 01:08:42,000
gradually over time

1897
01:08:46,950 --> 01:08:44,480
become one that involves more historical

1898
01:08:49,910 --> 01:08:46,960
and investigative uh work and also it is

1899
01:08:52,070 --> 01:08:49,920
one that is very heavily politicized and

1900
01:08:53,910 --> 01:08:52,080
has become in the minds of some a very

1901
01:08:55,669 --> 01:08:53,920
political movement toward

1902
01:08:57,590 --> 01:08:55,679
obtaining information by lobbying the

1903
01:08:59,110 --> 01:08:57,600
government and i'm not criticizing those

1904
01:09:00,950 --> 01:08:59,120
because some of the great work that has

1905
01:09:03,030 --> 01:09:00,960
been done by people like uh stanton

1906
01:09:04,309 --> 01:09:03,040
friedman groundbreaking work in fact and

1907
01:09:06,709 --> 01:09:04,319
some of the the data that he has

1908
01:09:08,550 --> 01:09:06,719
retrieved from foia and the national

1909
01:09:10,070 --> 01:09:08,560
archives it absolutely should not be

1910
01:09:11,990 --> 01:09:10,080
overlooked that said though what's

1911
01:09:14,149 --> 01:09:12,000
interesting is when i was with stanson

1912
01:09:16,070 --> 01:09:14,159
he and i were in a car together

1913
01:09:18,070 --> 01:09:16,080
being taken to a conference back in

1914
01:09:19,590 --> 01:09:18,080
february out in california and it was

1915
01:09:21,749 --> 01:09:19,600
one of the coolest and most surreal

1916
01:09:23,189 --> 01:09:21,759
experiences of my life jean because i

1917
01:09:24,870 --> 01:09:23,199
never get to really just hang out

1918
01:09:26,950 --> 01:09:24,880
one-on-one with stanton like this and we

1919
01:09:28,950 --> 01:09:26,960
were driving up through the hills our

1920
01:09:30,470 --> 01:09:28,960
driver had asked if we'd like to stop

1921
01:09:32,149 --> 01:09:30,480
and have lunch and neither of us were

1922
01:09:33,669 --> 01:09:32,159
really hungry but the driver said i'm

1923
01:09:35,110 --> 01:09:33,679
starving if you guys don't mind list i

1924
01:09:37,030 --> 01:09:35,120
got a great sandwich shop i want to take

1925
01:09:38,470 --> 01:09:37,040
you to it was february but it felt like

1926
01:09:39,910 --> 01:09:38,480
spring it was just beautiful and we

1927
01:09:41,030 --> 01:09:39,920
stopped in riverside california and

1928
01:09:43,189 --> 01:09:41,040
stanton and i are sitting there having

1929
01:09:45,110 --> 01:09:43,199
pastrami sandwiches and we had the best

1930
01:09:46,550 --> 01:09:45,120
conversation and i asked him i said

1931
01:09:48,309 --> 01:09:46,560
stanton what do you think about alan

1932
01:09:49,590 --> 01:09:48,319
hendry now a lot of people today

1933
01:09:52,070 --> 01:09:49,600
probably wouldn't even know who alan

1934
01:09:54,310 --> 01:09:52,080
henry is he's no longer really involved

1935
01:09:55,750 --> 01:09:54,320
at all in ufo studies stanton said ah

1936
01:09:57,110 --> 01:09:55,760
you know henry and i we had a lot of

1937
01:09:58,950 --> 01:09:57,120
different different opinions about

1938
01:10:01,110 --> 01:09:58,960
things and in my estimation he was a

1939
01:10:03,590 --> 01:10:01,120
little too skeptical and henry certainly

1940
01:10:04,950 --> 01:10:03,600
was a skeptical minded researcher he in

1941
01:10:06,950 --> 01:10:04,960
fact actually for a period of a couple

1942
01:10:08,790 --> 01:10:06,960
of years was the primary investigator

1943
01:10:11,189 --> 01:10:08,800
with the center for ufo studies in

1944
01:10:12,550 --> 01:10:11,199
chicago working under uh j alan heineck

1945
01:10:13,750 --> 01:10:12,560
and i bring him up here because again i

1946
01:10:15,350 --> 01:10:13,760
think that as far as people who have

1947
01:10:17,270 --> 01:10:15,360
really rather than doing the the

1948
01:10:18,870 --> 01:10:17,280
lobbying and the political kind of work

1949
01:10:21,430 --> 01:10:18,880
and the historical and the investigative

1950
01:10:23,669 --> 01:10:21,440
work henry was out there calling people

1951
01:10:26,149 --> 01:10:23,679
he was calling and discussing

1952
01:10:28,870 --> 01:10:26,159
observations made by witnesses to the uh

1953
01:10:30,630 --> 01:10:28,880
center for ufo studies he was calling

1954
01:10:32,709 --> 01:10:30,640
airports he was calling advertising

1955
01:10:34,070 --> 01:10:32,719
plane companies he was calling the

1956
01:10:37,189 --> 01:10:34,080
national weather service he was

1957
01:10:38,550 --> 01:10:37,199
investigating possible explanations for

1958
01:10:40,709 --> 01:10:38,560
things that were seen and in the

1959
01:10:42,390 --> 01:10:40,719
minority of reports there were cases

1960
01:10:44,229 --> 01:10:42,400
that could not be explained through

1961
01:10:47,270 --> 01:10:44,239
prosaic phenomena he wrote a book in

1962
01:10:49,669 --> 01:10:47,280
1979 called the ufo handbook that even

1963
01:10:51,270 --> 01:10:49,679
the arch debunker philip class said was

1964
01:10:53,189 --> 01:10:51,280
one of the most important books on ufo's

1965
01:10:55,510 --> 01:10:53,199
ever written and boy let me tell you it

1966
01:10:57,510 --> 01:10:55,520
is there are many copies on amazon but

1967
01:10:59,270 --> 01:10:57,520
you can still buy it and i bought one

1968
01:11:01,189 --> 01:10:59,280
and recently told our good friend greg

1969
01:11:02,550 --> 01:11:01,199
bishop that he needed to get one as well

1970
01:11:03,830 --> 01:11:02,560
it's one of the most fascinating books

1971
01:11:06,310 --> 01:11:03,840
if you're really interested in studying

1972
01:11:07,510 --> 01:11:06,320
ufos through science that could be read

1973
01:11:10,070 --> 01:11:07,520
and in the book it was interesting

1974
01:11:12,870 --> 01:11:10,080
because henry was discussing the initial

1975
01:11:14,390 --> 01:11:12,880
classification system that heinek had

1976
01:11:15,830 --> 01:11:14,400
employed this goes all the way back to

1977
01:11:18,149 --> 01:11:15,840
the time that heinek had been a science

1978
01:11:19,990 --> 01:11:18,159
advisor to the us air force with their

1979
01:11:21,669 --> 01:11:20,000
project blue book now let's keep in mind

1980
01:11:23,669 --> 01:11:21,679
that heineken said early on that he was

1981
01:11:25,030 --> 01:11:23,679
a skeptic and as time went on he really

1982
01:11:26,950 --> 01:11:25,040
began to think that there was just too

1983
01:11:28,310 --> 01:11:26,960
much to this phenomena that it could be

1984
01:11:30,709 --> 01:11:28,320
all explained through swamp gas and

1985
01:11:32,790 --> 01:11:30,719
other prosaic phenomena but his initial

1986
01:11:34,790 --> 01:11:32,800
classification system which he describes

1987
01:11:37,030 --> 01:11:34,800
in the heineck ufo report and i think

1988
01:11:38,950 --> 01:11:37,040
before that also in the ufo the ufo

1989
01:11:41,189 --> 01:11:38,960
phenomena a scientific inquiry he

1990
01:11:43,270 --> 01:11:41,199
discusses this basic classification

1991
01:11:45,590 --> 01:11:43,280
system that would help him group types

1992
01:11:47,350 --> 01:11:45,600
of observations the first were nocturnal

1993
01:11:49,030 --> 01:11:47,360
lights and then the second which is the

1994
01:11:51,189 --> 01:11:49,040
one i really began to have problems with

1995
01:11:53,669 --> 01:11:51,199
daylight discs and heineken himself

1996
01:11:56,630 --> 01:11:53,679
would say you know a daylight disc was

1997
01:11:57,669 --> 01:11:56,640
sometimes egg-shaped spherical tubular

1998
01:11:59,189 --> 01:11:57,679
sometimes they were just you know

1999
01:12:00,790 --> 01:11:59,199
amorphous blobs but they were things

2000
01:12:02,709 --> 01:12:00,800
that were seen in the daylight in other

2001
01:12:04,790 --> 01:12:02,719
words they weren't all discs and it

2002
01:12:07,110 --> 01:12:04,800
seemed apparent to me that this daylight

2003
01:12:09,110 --> 01:12:07,120
disc is was really very well informed by

2004
01:12:10,790 --> 01:12:09,120
the meme that goes all the way back to

2005
01:12:12,950 --> 01:12:10,800
kenneth arnold the idea of a flying

2006
01:12:15,350 --> 01:12:12,960
saucer or a disc when in fact there are

2007
01:12:16,630 --> 01:12:15,360
varying interpretations of what arnold

2008
01:12:18,790 --> 01:12:16,640
actually saw

2009
01:12:20,790 --> 01:12:18,800
he described them as their locomotion

2010
01:12:22,229 --> 01:12:20,800
was more like a disc skipping across

2011
01:12:25,270 --> 01:12:22,239
water but he didn't necessarily say that

2012
01:12:26,630 --> 01:12:25,280
they were disc or saucer shaped not to

2013
01:12:29,590 --> 01:12:26,640
say that there aren't certain ufo

2014
01:12:32,390 --> 01:12:29,600
reports that don't actually involve disc

2015
01:12:33,750 --> 01:12:32,400
or saucer-shaped craft the next tier of

2016
01:12:35,030 --> 01:12:33,760
classification that heinrich talked

2017
01:12:36,550 --> 01:12:35,040
about of course and gene i know you know

2018
01:12:38,070 --> 01:12:36,560
all these but you know for those just as

2019
01:12:40,070 --> 01:12:38,080
a recap in the listening audience we had

2020
01:12:42,470 --> 01:12:40,080
radar visual cases

2021
01:12:44,790 --> 01:12:42,480
and then we had uh the groupings of

2022
01:12:46,390 --> 01:12:44,800
close encounter cases which were the

2023
01:12:48,229 --> 01:12:46,400
close encounter ones

2024
01:12:50,550 --> 01:12:48,239
a ufo observed interacting physically

2025
01:12:52,550 --> 01:12:50,560
within with its environment became the

2026
01:12:55,350 --> 01:12:52,560
second close encounter grouping and then

2027
01:12:57,590 --> 01:12:55,360
the third close encounter grouping ce3s

2028
01:12:59,350 --> 01:12:57,600
would be a ufo observed apparently with

2029
01:13:01,830 --> 01:12:59,360
occupants or entities that might have

2030
01:13:03,350 --> 01:13:01,840
been associated with that that object

2031
01:13:04,790 --> 01:13:03,360
after heineck died there were other

2032
01:13:06,550 --> 01:13:04,800
groupings that were introduced just as

2033
01:13:08,630 --> 01:13:06,560
well the ce4s

2034
01:13:10,390 --> 01:13:08,640
which involve essentially physical

2035
01:13:12,550 --> 01:13:10,400
transport of an individual between two

2036
01:13:15,669 --> 01:13:12,560
locations as it relates to a ufo

2037
01:13:17,669 --> 01:13:15,679
observation which would indicate what

2038
01:13:18,870 --> 01:13:17,679
appears to be an abduction there's the

2039
01:13:20,550 --> 01:13:18,880
fifth category and this is where things

2040
01:13:23,830 --> 01:13:20,560
get a little weird because there are

2041
01:13:25,430 --> 01:13:23,840
differing interpretations of what a ce5

2042
01:13:27,590 --> 01:13:25,440
close encounter of the fifth kind should

2043
01:13:30,070 --> 01:13:27,600
be the first interpretation had been uh

2044
01:13:32,070 --> 01:13:30,080
one that uh jacques valet had called for

2045
01:13:33,430 --> 01:13:32,080
he believed that a physical injury case

2046
01:13:35,430 --> 01:13:33,440
where a person had been physically

2047
01:13:37,030 --> 01:13:35,440
affected or injured or had had a mark

2048
01:13:39,910 --> 01:13:37,040
left on them by an interaction with the

2049
01:13:41,990 --> 01:13:39,920
ufo this was a ce5 first of all the

2050
01:13:44,470 --> 01:13:42,000
daylight disc isn't always a disc and

2051
01:13:46,630 --> 01:13:44,480
furthermore we could say that again if a

2052
01:13:48,229 --> 01:13:46,640
ce2 close encounter the second kind

2053
01:13:50,070 --> 01:13:48,239
involves a ufo

2054
01:13:52,229 --> 01:13:50,080
which apparently affects the environment

2055
01:13:53,910 --> 01:13:52,239
in some way well that might also involve

2056
01:13:56,149 --> 01:13:53,920
individuals and so that's very similar

2057
01:13:57,110 --> 01:13:56,159
to valet's interpretation of what a ce5

2058
01:13:58,470 --> 01:13:57,120
would be

2059
01:14:00,149 --> 01:13:58,480
you can start to see that these kind of

2060
01:14:01,430 --> 01:14:00,159
spill over into one another and i wonder

2061
01:14:03,750 --> 01:14:01,440
sometimes if things hadn't gotten a

2062
01:14:05,910 --> 01:14:03,760
little convoluted the classification

2063
01:14:07,669 --> 01:14:05,920
terminology didn't utilize the best

2064
01:14:09,830 --> 01:14:07,679
terminology for the phenomena it

2065
01:14:11,350 --> 01:14:09,840
attempted to describe i'll say at this

2066
01:14:13,430 --> 01:14:11,360
point if people are interested in

2067
01:14:15,830 --> 01:14:13,440
reading further about this at my website

2068
01:14:17,830 --> 01:14:15,840
micah hanks dot com forward slash blog

2069
01:14:19,669 --> 01:14:17,840
use an article there that is titled

2070
01:14:21,830 --> 01:14:19,679
toward a better ufology applying science

2071
01:14:24,229 --> 01:14:21,840
to the study of uap where i actually

2072
01:14:25,669 --> 01:14:24,239
break down a new classification system

2073
01:14:27,510 --> 01:14:25,679
that we can get into as long as we're

2074
01:14:30,149 --> 01:14:27,520
not getting too close to a break why

2075
01:14:32,709 --> 01:14:30,159
don't you be brief about it how this new

2076
01:14:34,550 --> 01:14:32,719
classification system would differ from

2077
01:14:36,790 --> 01:14:34,560
the old and then we can expand upon it

2078
01:14:38,790 --> 01:14:36,800
in the next segment this is a new

2079
01:14:40,310 --> 01:14:38,800
classification system rather than with

2080
01:14:42,390 --> 01:14:40,320
all the close encounter cases it really

2081
01:14:44,229 --> 01:14:42,400
breaks things down into a six point

2082
01:14:45,990 --> 01:14:44,239
classification system that consolidates

2083
01:14:48,149 --> 01:14:46,000
some of the old ones and also accounts

2084
01:14:51,350 --> 01:14:48,159
for new phenomena as well as new

2085
01:14:53,750 --> 01:14:51,360
technologies with a system of checks as

2086
01:14:55,910 --> 01:14:53,760
it were a kind of filtration system and

2087
01:14:57,750 --> 01:14:55,920
the categories very simply are nocturnal

2088
01:14:59,430 --> 01:14:57,760
luminous phenomena daylight luminous

2089
01:15:01,510 --> 01:14:59,440
phenomena aerial craft or structured

2090
01:15:03,510 --> 01:15:01,520
objects objects corroborated with radar

2091
01:15:05,350 --> 01:15:03,520
or other technology which i'll cover in

2092
01:15:06,550 --> 01:15:05,360
the next segment objects that interact

2093
01:15:07,830 --> 01:15:06,560
physically with individuals with the

2094
01:15:10,070 --> 01:15:07,840
environment and finally objects

2095
01:15:11,590 --> 01:15:10,080
accompanied by beings or parent

2096
01:15:13,750 --> 01:15:11,600
operators we can talk more about it in

2097
01:15:15,669 --> 01:15:13,760
the next little portion all right we're

2098
01:15:17,590 --> 01:15:15,679
going to try to figure this out but we

2099
01:15:19,110 --> 01:15:17,600
still have a little bit of time left so

2100
01:15:21,270 --> 01:15:19,120
why don't you continue go for another

2101
01:15:23,669 --> 01:15:21,280
minute or so the reason for the

2102
01:15:26,229 --> 01:15:23,679
institution of this new

2103
01:15:27,910 --> 01:15:26,239
series is because i think that as we i

2104
01:15:31,430 --> 01:15:27,920
think can all agree we have new

2105
01:15:33,750 --> 01:15:31,440
technology namely drones which certainly

2106
01:15:35,910 --> 01:15:33,760
can account for some observation of

2107
01:15:37,910 --> 01:15:35,920
things seen in the sky we also have new

2108
01:15:39,590 --> 01:15:37,920
technology available at our disposal

2109
01:15:42,070 --> 01:15:39,600
that i think helped broaden the ways

2110
01:15:43,669 --> 01:15:42,080
that ufos can be studied heineck first

2111
01:15:46,229 --> 01:15:43,679
instituted his classification system

2112
01:15:48,310 --> 01:15:46,239
decades ago it was still in use decades

2113
01:15:49,669 --> 01:15:48,320
later when the center for ufo studies

2114
01:15:51,990 --> 01:15:49,679
was operating when alan hendry was

2115
01:15:53,750 --> 01:15:52,000
writing his book on ufos today there

2116
01:15:56,310 --> 01:15:53,760
seems to be apart from again civilian

2117
01:15:58,229 --> 01:15:56,320
groups like mufon and others that use

2118
01:16:00,709 --> 01:15:58,239
their own kind of methods of inquiry i

2119
01:16:02,550 --> 01:16:00,719
haven't seen recently a very serious

2120
01:16:04,709 --> 01:16:02,560
standardized kind of classification

2121
01:16:06,709 --> 01:16:04,719
system on par with what hynek used so

2122
01:16:09,430 --> 01:16:06,719
what i'm hoping to institute with this

2123
01:16:11,350 --> 01:16:09,440
is a new system a modernized system and

2124
01:16:12,790 --> 01:16:11,360
one that works a little more simply with

2125
01:16:15,270 --> 01:16:12,800
science and mind as it applies to the

2126
01:16:17,430 --> 01:16:15,280
study of ufos okay a new ufo

2127
01:16:19,990 --> 01:16:17,440
classification system after what was

2128
01:16:21,510 --> 01:16:20,000
done in the 1970s with dr j allen

2129
01:16:23,430 --> 01:16:21,520
heineck and the people he worked with at

2130
01:16:26,070 --> 01:16:23,440
the center for ufo studies

2131
01:16:28,550 --> 01:16:26,080
chris o'brien is on walkabout that's all

2132
01:16:30,950 --> 01:16:28,560
i'll say he's definitely out there we

2133
01:16:38,950 --> 01:16:30,960
have micah hanks of ghrelian report with

2134
01:16:43,149 --> 01:16:42,229
thank you for listening to gcn

2135
01:16:48,070 --> 01:16:43,159
visit

2136
01:16:52,550 --> 01:16:49,990
other network provides the level of

2137
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2138
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2139
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2140
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2141
01:17:06,070 --> 01:17:03,600
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2142
01:17:07,830 --> 01:17:06,080
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2143
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2144
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2145
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2146
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2147
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2148
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2149
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2150
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2151
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2152
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2153
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2154
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2155
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2156
01:17:49,350 --> 01:17:43,590
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2157
01:17:53,669 --> 01:17:52,310
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2158
01:17:55,750 --> 01:17:53,679
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2159
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2160
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2161
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2163
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2166
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2174
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2177
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2179
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2180
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2181
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2192
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2197
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2201
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2202
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2207
01:19:51,510 --> 01:19:48,640
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2208
01:19:53,990 --> 01:19:51,520
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2209
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01:20:00,149 --> 01:19:57,280
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2211
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2212
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2213
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2214
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2216
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2217
01:20:18,550 --> 01:20:16,640
doctors have taken people off of some or

2218
01:20:20,790 --> 01:20:18,560
all of their pills just because they

2219
01:20:23,270 --> 01:20:20,800
believe their patients got better while

2220
01:20:25,830 --> 01:20:23,280
taking extendovite get the dependability

2221
01:20:28,229 --> 01:20:25,840
of extendovite just see how you feel in

2222
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2223
01:20:32,470 --> 01:20:30,880
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2224
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shipping and handling

2225
01:20:58,149 --> 01:20:55,350
[Music]

2226
01:21:00,660 --> 01:20:58,159
you're listening to the power cast

2227
01:21:05,910 --> 01:21:00,670
the gold standard of paranormal radio

2228
01:21:08,709 --> 01:21:05,920
[Music]

2229
01:21:11,750 --> 01:21:08,719
okay the classification system the new

2230
01:21:13,669 --> 01:21:11,760
one that you're proposing number one

2231
01:21:15,510 --> 01:21:13,679
and i don't know if you've been specific

2232
01:21:16,870 --> 01:21:15,520
enough about this what's wrong with the

2233
01:21:19,110 --> 01:21:16,880
one we have

2234
01:21:21,430 --> 01:21:19,120
well the one that we have dealt with for

2235
01:21:23,270 --> 01:21:21,440
a number of years again as i the first

2236
01:21:24,550 --> 01:21:23,280
point that i made about that was that

2237
01:21:26,229 --> 01:21:24,560
you know we have this

2238
01:21:28,870 --> 01:21:26,239
designation of what are called daylight

2239
01:21:30,229 --> 01:21:28,880
disks that's what hynek used to refer to

2240
01:21:31,669 --> 01:21:30,239
any number of different kind of things

2241
01:21:33,350 --> 01:21:31,679
that are seen

2242
01:21:35,430 --> 01:21:33,360
in the daylight again i think i would

2243
01:21:37,270 --> 01:21:35,440
make a differentiation between what he

2244
01:21:38,950 --> 01:21:37,280
called nocturnal lights

2245
01:21:40,630 --> 01:21:38,960
and then any kind of a structured object

2246
01:21:42,470 --> 01:21:40,640
that might be seen in the daylight which

2247
01:21:43,830 --> 01:21:42,480
of course is already pointed out may not

2248
01:21:45,910 --> 01:21:43,840
necessarily

2249
01:21:48,470 --> 01:21:45,920
be disc shaped now hynek certainly knew

2250
01:21:50,470 --> 01:21:48,480
that and he certainly made a case

2251
01:21:52,149 --> 01:21:50,480
for the fact that any number of things

2252
01:21:54,149 --> 01:21:52,159
might fall under that categorization

2253
01:21:55,669 --> 01:21:54,159
that he used the daylight discs and

2254
01:21:57,669 --> 01:21:55,679
again i think that that term that he

2255
01:21:59,590 --> 01:21:57,679
used borrowed heavily from the flying

2256
01:22:02,310 --> 01:21:59,600
saucer meme that emerged right after

2257
01:22:04,149 --> 01:22:02,320
1947 and with the arnold case

2258
01:22:06,229 --> 01:22:04,159
but the problem is and this is another

2259
01:22:07,510 --> 01:22:06,239
issue i think that we see nocturnal

2260
01:22:08,870 --> 01:22:07,520
lights would be any kind of an

2261
01:22:10,070 --> 01:22:08,880
illumination that might be seen at night

2262
01:22:11,990 --> 01:22:10,080
but let's think about this for a moment

2263
01:22:13,270 --> 01:22:12,000
let's say that you see a group of lights

2264
01:22:15,189 --> 01:22:13,280
at night

2265
01:22:17,830 --> 01:22:15,199
okay and let's say that they're flying

2266
01:22:19,430 --> 01:22:17,840
in an apparent triangular formation well

2267
01:22:21,830 --> 01:22:19,440
the lights that you see could be

2268
01:22:24,310 --> 01:22:21,840
interpreted in one of two ways with the

2269
01:22:25,350 --> 01:22:24,320
lacking uh visibility that nighttime

2270
01:22:26,870 --> 01:22:25,360
presents

2271
01:22:29,189 --> 01:22:26,880
either these are three points of light

2272
01:22:31,430 --> 01:22:29,199
that are attached to a larger object or

2273
01:22:33,430 --> 01:22:31,440
these are three independent objects that

2274
01:22:35,750 --> 01:22:33,440
are traveling in formation now

2275
01:22:38,470 --> 01:22:35,760
one might assume that if daylight

2276
01:22:40,709 --> 01:22:38,480
luminous phenomena were observed

2277
01:22:41,990 --> 01:22:40,719
that these phenomena might not be

2278
01:22:43,350 --> 01:22:42,000
interpreted the same way that they would

2279
01:22:44,709 --> 01:22:43,360
be at night for instance if you see

2280
01:22:45,910 --> 01:22:44,719
these three points at night you're not

2281
01:22:47,510 --> 01:22:45,920
sure if they're attached to a larger

2282
01:22:49,270 --> 01:22:47,520
object or flying in formation but in the

2283
01:22:51,590 --> 01:22:49,280
daylight if they were attached to an

2284
01:22:53,189 --> 01:22:51,600
object presumably and this is putting

2285
01:22:54,790 --> 01:22:53,199
aside you know theories about different

2286
01:22:56,950 --> 01:22:54,800
kind of cloaking technologies and things

2287
01:22:58,870 --> 01:22:56,960
that ufos might use there is some

2288
01:23:00,709 --> 01:22:58,880
evidence for this in certain uh

2289
01:23:02,709 --> 01:23:00,719
literature about the subject

2290
01:23:04,070 --> 01:23:02,719
but again if you see illuminations in

2291
01:23:05,430 --> 01:23:04,080
the daylight you're going to see again

2292
01:23:07,430 --> 01:23:05,440
three points of light if there's no

2293
01:23:09,510 --> 01:23:07,440
apparent object between them it becomes

2294
01:23:11,510 --> 01:23:09,520
all the more clear that in the daylight

2295
01:23:13,110 --> 01:23:11,520
these illuminations one observes are

2296
01:23:15,030 --> 01:23:13,120
flying in formation rather than being

2297
01:23:16,229 --> 01:23:15,040
attached to a craft because if there

2298
01:23:17,990 --> 01:23:16,239
were a craft in the daylight you'd be

2299
01:23:19,590 --> 01:23:18,000
able to see it i hope that's clear so

2300
01:23:21,669 --> 01:23:19,600
the point is is that i thought it would

2301
01:23:24,229 --> 01:23:21,679
be interesting to make a distinction

2302
01:23:26,070 --> 01:23:24,239
between luminous phenomena observed at

2303
01:23:27,510 --> 01:23:26,080
night and in the daylight

2304
01:23:29,270 --> 01:23:27,520
and the reason for the distinction

2305
01:23:30,870 --> 01:23:29,280
between the daylight luminous phenomena

2306
01:23:34,470 --> 01:23:30,880
and what i would call structured objects

2307
01:23:36,149 --> 01:23:34,480
is because frankly as we progress

2308
01:23:37,750 --> 01:23:36,159
scientifically we have learned an awful

2309
01:23:39,270 --> 01:23:37,760
lot more about the different varieties

2310
01:23:40,629 --> 01:23:39,280
of luminous phenomena that appear to be

2311
01:23:41,669 --> 01:23:40,639
of natural

2312
01:23:43,830 --> 01:23:41,679
origin

2313
01:23:45,270 --> 01:23:43,840
namely ball lightning type plasmas

2314
01:23:47,350 --> 01:23:45,280
earthquake lights and things like this

2315
01:23:48,709 --> 01:23:47,360
so when luminous phenomena is observed

2316
01:23:50,310 --> 01:23:48,719
and there's enough daylight to be able

2317
01:23:52,310 --> 01:23:50,320
to distinguish it from being a part of

2318
01:23:53,750 --> 01:23:52,320
some other object i think that that is

2319
01:23:56,070 --> 01:23:53,760
something that certainly has to be taken

2320
01:23:57,830 --> 01:23:56,080
into consideration with ufo studies so

2321
01:23:59,510 --> 01:23:57,840
the first two tiers of a new

2322
01:24:00,629 --> 01:23:59,520
classification system as i was putting

2323
01:24:02,870 --> 01:24:00,639
this together

2324
01:24:04,709 --> 01:24:02,880
involve the nocturnal luminous phenomena

2325
01:24:06,470 --> 01:24:04,719
as heineken first proposed but then the

2326
01:24:09,430 --> 01:24:06,480
second one rather than daylight discs is

2327
01:24:11,110 --> 01:24:09,440
daylight luminous phenomena and i think

2328
01:24:12,790 --> 01:24:11,120
it's again important that we make those

2329
01:24:14,790 --> 01:24:12,800
two distinctions then in the third

2330
01:24:16,629 --> 01:24:14,800
designation i propose we've got what we

2331
01:24:19,110 --> 01:24:16,639
call the aerial craft or structured

2332
01:24:21,510 --> 01:24:19,120
objects and i'm careful to say aerial

2333
01:24:24,149 --> 01:24:21,520
craft or structured objects because some

2334
01:24:25,270 --> 01:24:24,159
of these may appear to be you know

2335
01:24:26,310 --> 01:24:25,280
i don't know if you'd want to call them

2336
01:24:28,070 --> 01:24:26,320
planes but i think that there are a

2337
01:24:29,990 --> 01:24:28,080
variety of things that you know would

2338
01:24:32,149 --> 01:24:30,000
look more like a man-made kind of a

2339
01:24:33,830 --> 01:24:32,159
craft which simply is unidentifiable

2340
01:24:35,110 --> 01:24:33,840
kind of like let's look at some classic

2341
01:24:37,590 --> 01:24:35,120
literature that describes something

2342
01:24:39,030 --> 01:24:37,600
similar ghost rockets for instance

2343
01:24:40,870 --> 01:24:39,040
the early reports of these things seen

2344
01:24:41,830 --> 01:24:40,880
over scandinavia they were likened very

2345
01:24:43,830 --> 01:24:41,840
much

2346
01:24:45,669 --> 01:24:43,840
to man-made technologies but we didn't

2347
01:24:48,629 --> 01:24:45,679
know where they came from

2348
01:24:49,830 --> 01:24:48,639
so we have aerial craft and then there's

2349
01:24:51,590 --> 01:24:49,840
also the idea that there's something

2350
01:24:54,149 --> 01:24:51,600
that's extremely exotic that we might

2351
01:24:55,350 --> 01:24:54,159
not so easily liken it to in terms of

2352
01:24:56,870 --> 01:24:55,360
things that we know to exist but it

2353
01:24:59,910 --> 01:24:56,880
nonetheless appears to be something that

2354
01:25:02,070 --> 01:24:59,920
is designed or or constructed and maybe

2355
01:25:04,310 --> 01:25:02,080
under intelligent control hence these

2356
01:25:06,229 --> 01:25:04,320
structured objects

2357
01:25:08,070 --> 01:25:06,239
now again you can tell that with a

2358
01:25:09,350 --> 01:25:08,080
structured object seen in the sky you

2359
01:25:10,390 --> 01:25:09,360
would probably

2360
01:25:12,390 --> 01:25:10,400
you know presume that this would be

2361
01:25:13,590 --> 01:25:12,400
something seen in the daytime but let's

2362
01:25:14,790 --> 01:25:13,600
say that you see something that is

2363
01:25:16,950 --> 01:25:14,800
obviously some sort of material

2364
01:25:18,470 --> 01:25:16,960
structure seen at night many people when

2365
01:25:20,870 --> 01:25:18,480
they describe for instance these large

2366
01:25:22,470 --> 01:25:20,880
triangle-shaped ufos they describe

2367
01:25:23,830 --> 01:25:22,480
rather than seeing the lights they say

2368
01:25:26,310 --> 01:25:23,840
that we were standing outside it was

2369
01:25:28,229 --> 01:25:26,320
just after dark and what we saw was a

2370
01:25:31,110 --> 01:25:28,239
physical shape moving through the sky

2371
01:25:33,510 --> 01:25:31,120
that darkened the sky and obscured the

2372
01:25:35,270 --> 01:25:33,520
stars which would seem to be what now

2373
01:25:37,350 --> 01:25:35,280
this is interesting if no lights were

2374
01:25:38,790 --> 01:25:37,360
present there's no luminous phenomena

2375
01:25:41,189 --> 01:25:38,800
associated with it but a structured

2376
01:25:42,870 --> 01:25:41,199
object was nonetheless implied and and

2377
01:25:44,629 --> 01:25:42,880
thus we could see that the structured

2378
01:25:46,790 --> 01:25:44,639
object could appear at night as well

2379
01:25:49,270 --> 01:25:46,800
when heineck started talking about the

2380
01:25:51,830 --> 01:25:49,280
um radar visual cases which were his

2381
01:25:53,110 --> 01:25:51,840
third point on his classification system

2382
01:25:55,590 --> 01:25:53,120
you know i think that it's important to

2383
01:25:57,830 --> 01:25:55,600
point out gene that with radar visuals

2384
01:26:00,709 --> 01:25:57,840
why would he have put such significance

2385
01:26:02,550 --> 01:26:00,719
behind radar visual cases well he was a

2386
01:26:04,629 --> 01:26:02,560
science advisor to the u.s air force at

2387
01:26:07,270 --> 01:26:04,639
that time and heineck of course was

2388
01:26:10,310 --> 01:26:07,280
investigating this for the air force and

2389
01:26:11,910 --> 01:26:10,320
skeptically so the best cases

2390
01:26:13,669 --> 01:26:11,920
would be those which would utilize the

2391
01:26:15,990 --> 01:26:13,679
best available technology that would

2392
01:26:17,430 --> 01:26:16,000
help substantiate certain reports and

2393
01:26:19,510 --> 01:26:17,440
the best technology available at that

2394
01:26:21,510 --> 01:26:19,520
time arguably was radar immediately

2395
01:26:23,990 --> 01:26:21,520
after the war of course and with the air

2396
01:26:25,590 --> 01:26:24,000
force and its involvement in ufo cases

2397
01:26:28,629 --> 01:26:25,600
you know radar was going to be probably

2398
01:26:30,149 --> 01:26:28,639
the chief technological means by which a

2399
01:26:32,470 --> 01:26:30,159
sighting of visual sighting might be

2400
01:26:34,229 --> 01:26:32,480
corroborated but today we've got others

2401
01:26:35,990 --> 01:26:34,239
you know in this era in which we all

2402
01:26:37,510 --> 01:26:36,000
carry little smartphones around in our

2403
01:26:39,830 --> 01:26:37,520
pocket with cameras on them i mean many

2404
01:26:42,310 --> 01:26:39,840
people can use a smartphone not just to

2405
01:26:43,990 --> 01:26:42,320
be able to capture video or a photograph

2406
01:26:46,149 --> 01:26:44,000
but they can also use things like flight

2407
01:26:47,750 --> 01:26:46,159
radar 24 which is an app that lets you

2408
01:26:49,910 --> 01:26:47,760
determine what kind of aircraft are in

2409
01:26:50,709 --> 01:26:49,920
the sky and where they are at any given

2410
01:26:53,030 --> 01:26:50,719
time

2411
01:26:54,709 --> 01:26:53,040
you can use you know photo programs to

2412
01:26:56,629 --> 01:26:54,719
determine the time and place a

2413
01:26:58,310 --> 01:26:56,639
photograph was taken you've got

2414
01:27:00,470 --> 01:26:58,320
stargazing apps that help you

2415
01:27:02,709 --> 01:27:00,480
distinguish various celestial phenomena

2416
01:27:04,070 --> 01:27:02,719
and most of them do a lot without really

2417
01:27:06,550 --> 01:27:04,080
having to pay much for them there's some

2418
01:27:08,870 --> 01:27:06,560
great free stargazing apps you've got

2419
01:27:10,470 --> 01:27:08,880
satellite tracking apps like sputnik

2420
01:27:11,830 --> 01:27:10,480
and i have a lot of these on my phone

2421
01:27:13,270 --> 01:27:11,840
and so the thing is i began to think

2422
01:27:14,470 --> 01:27:13,280
that gosh you know if people use them in

2423
01:27:16,470 --> 01:27:14,480
the right way

2424
01:27:18,390 --> 01:27:16,480
hypothetically you can use a smartphone

2425
01:27:20,229 --> 01:27:18,400
like a little multi-function device for

2426
01:27:21,910 --> 01:27:20,239
studying strange things that you might

2427
01:27:23,270 --> 01:27:21,920
see in the sky and in likelihood

2428
01:27:24,629 --> 01:27:23,280
discerning

2429
01:27:26,229 --> 01:27:24,639
you know those things which can be

2430
01:27:28,950 --> 01:27:26,239
identifiable from those which truly

2431
01:27:31,350 --> 01:27:28,960
might remain unidentifiable so in the

2432
01:27:33,510 --> 01:27:31,360
modern era rather than just saying radar

2433
01:27:34,950 --> 01:27:33,520
visuals the fourth tier i describe is

2434
01:27:36,950 --> 01:27:34,960
objects that can be corroborated with

2435
01:27:38,310 --> 01:27:36,960
radar or maybe with satellite like

2436
01:27:40,390 --> 01:27:38,320
global positioning

2437
01:27:42,390 --> 01:27:40,400
photographs video or other smartphone

2438
01:27:44,709 --> 01:27:42,400
apps and i would also add this to it

2439
01:27:46,629 --> 01:27:44,719
electromagnetic phenomena that can be

2440
01:27:49,030 --> 01:27:46,639
observed using such things as an

2441
01:27:50,709 --> 01:27:49,040
electromagnetic field detector or an rf

2442
01:27:52,550 --> 01:27:50,719
detector going all the way back to

2443
01:27:54,550 --> 01:27:52,560
edward ripple's report on identified

2444
01:27:57,110 --> 01:27:54,560
flying objects from 1950 well i guess

2445
01:27:59,270 --> 01:27:57,120
the original edition was 56.

2446
01:28:00,550 --> 01:27:59,280
he had talked about in one chapter

2447
01:28:02,310 --> 01:28:00,560
scientists that claimed that in

2448
01:28:04,550 --> 01:28:02,320
conjunction with ufo sightings there

2449
01:28:05,910 --> 01:28:04,560
were variances in radiation background

2450
01:28:07,669 --> 01:28:05,920
radiation that could be discerned so

2451
01:28:09,990 --> 01:28:07,679
something like a geiger counter or an

2452
01:28:12,229 --> 01:28:10,000
electromagnetic field detective device

2453
01:28:15,189 --> 01:28:12,239
should be able to help corroborate ufo

2454
01:28:18,149 --> 01:28:15,199
reports just as well so now

2455
01:28:19,510 --> 01:28:18,159
that you've heard all that let us have

2456
01:28:21,110 --> 01:28:19,520
the final

2457
01:28:22,790 --> 01:28:21,120
entry

2458
01:28:24,550 --> 01:28:22,800
well there are two actually objects that

2459
01:28:27,189 --> 01:28:24,560
interact physically with individuals or

2460
01:28:28,870 --> 01:28:27,199
the environment and this is again a

2461
01:28:31,110 --> 01:28:28,880
simple classification that deals with a

2462
01:28:32,310 --> 01:28:31,120
lot of stuff gene we're talking about

2463
01:28:34,390 --> 01:28:32,320
objects

2464
01:28:35,910 --> 01:28:34,400
that interact with perhaps they'd leave

2465
01:28:37,189 --> 01:28:35,920
ground markings you know chris o'brien

2466
01:28:38,950 --> 01:28:37,199
with a lot of his research with the

2467
01:28:40,070 --> 01:28:38,960
cattle mute phenomenon certainly has

2468
01:28:41,910 --> 01:28:40,080
involved

2469
01:28:43,270 --> 01:28:41,920
himself in instances where there are

2470
01:28:45,350 --> 01:28:43,280
markings found on the ground near some

2471
01:28:47,510 --> 01:28:45,360
of these carcasses if it interacts with

2472
01:28:49,350 --> 01:28:47,520
an individual again a person says that

2473
01:28:51,030 --> 01:28:49,360
the object flashes light at them a

2474
01:28:52,390 --> 01:28:51,040
person says they're moved by the object

2475
01:28:53,270 --> 01:28:52,400
a person says they're taking a border

2476
01:28:54,470 --> 01:28:53,280
craft

2477
01:28:56,310 --> 01:28:54,480
you know any of these kind of things

2478
01:28:58,070 --> 01:28:56,320
animal disturbance would qualify too

2479
01:28:59,270 --> 01:28:58,080
it's a very simple classification system

2480
01:29:00,709 --> 01:28:59,280
that deals with a broad range of

2481
01:29:03,110 --> 01:29:00,719
different phenomena and part of the

2482
01:29:05,350 --> 01:29:03,120
reason i consolidate those is because

2483
01:29:06,790 --> 01:29:05,360
there are fewer reports these days that

2484
01:29:08,629 --> 01:29:06,800
seem to involve these kind of things

2485
01:29:10,709 --> 01:29:08,639
where people interact with the ufo or

2486
01:29:13,030 --> 01:29:10,719
their you know capable of getting close

2487
01:29:14,629 --> 01:29:13,040
to a grounded one you and i don't know

2488
01:29:16,070 --> 01:29:14,639
why but nick redfern's talked about this

2489
01:29:18,070 --> 01:29:16,080
as well and i've found a number of

2490
01:29:20,390 --> 01:29:18,080
articles online there seemed to be a

2491
01:29:21,910 --> 01:29:20,400
marked decline in these kind of close

2492
01:29:23,430 --> 01:29:21,920
encounter type cases and then the final

2493
01:29:25,669 --> 01:29:23,440
is objects accompanied by beings or

2494
01:29:27,350 --> 01:29:25,679
apparent operators because however few

2495
01:29:29,270 --> 01:29:27,360
they may be today some people do still

2496
01:29:30,790 --> 01:29:29,280
report this kind of thing but i think

2497
01:29:32,790 --> 01:29:30,800
that this simplification of the

2498
01:29:35,030 --> 01:29:32,800
classification system helps to look at

2499
01:29:37,030 --> 01:29:35,040
this phenomena in the modern era

2500
01:29:38,390 --> 01:29:37,040
with respect to the new technology both

2501
01:29:40,390 --> 01:29:38,400
present in the skies and that which we

2502
01:29:41,910 --> 01:29:40,400
have available to us to try and study it

2503
01:29:44,310 --> 01:29:41,920
okay i'm going to ask you about this and

2504
01:29:46,149 --> 01:29:44,320
let's continue our next segment because

2505
01:29:48,390 --> 01:29:46,159
certainly these topics have come up in

2506
01:29:49,590 --> 01:29:48,400
questions from listeners and that is

2507
01:29:52,070 --> 01:29:49,600
we're not having

2508
01:29:53,910 --> 01:29:52,080
these real close encounters like the ce3

2509
01:29:55,910 --> 01:29:53,920
or whatever you want to call it

2510
01:29:58,870 --> 01:29:55,920
why is that why

2511
01:30:01,189 --> 01:29:58,880
do we not have these close-up sightings

2512
01:30:02,229 --> 01:30:01,199
as we did a while back some people say

2513
01:30:04,950 --> 01:30:02,239
you know what

2514
01:30:07,750 --> 01:30:04,960
for the most part the ufo phenomenon

2515
01:30:09,510 --> 01:30:07,760
no longer occurs and that if you put

2516
01:30:11,430 --> 01:30:09,520
things together you can take all those

2517
01:30:14,229 --> 01:30:11,440
sightings those distant sightings of

2518
01:30:15,750 --> 01:30:14,239
ufos and they probably have conventional

2519
01:30:17,669 --> 01:30:15,760
explanations

2520
01:30:19,830 --> 01:30:17,679
in which case there is no longer a ufo

2521
01:30:21,990 --> 01:30:19,840
mystery this is a very skeptical

2522
01:30:24,629 --> 01:30:22,000
question because i've expanded upon the

2523
01:30:26,790 --> 01:30:24,639
lack of the close encounters so let's

2524
01:30:29,189 --> 01:30:26,800
continue with that we have micah hanks

2525
01:30:31,189 --> 01:30:29,199
and he's from the grealian report chris

2526
01:30:39,030 --> 01:30:31,199
o'brien's on walkabout with gene and

2527
01:30:43,470 --> 01:30:42,550
you are listening to gcn

2528
01:30:44,920 --> 01:30:43,480
visit

2529
01:30:47,590 --> 01:30:44,930
gcnlive.com today

2530
01:30:49,430 --> 01:30:47,600
[Music]

2531
01:30:51,750 --> 01:30:49,440
graphic converter is the image

2532
01:30:54,709 --> 01:30:51,760
manipulation tool for the rest of us it

2533
01:30:56,790 --> 01:30:54,719
does not use any database you get full

2534
01:30:59,350 --> 01:30:56,800
control of all your files want to view

2535
01:31:02,149 --> 01:30:59,360
the images of a folder drag it into

2536
01:31:04,470 --> 01:31:02,159
graphic inverter and a powerful browser

2537
01:31:06,550 --> 01:31:04,480
opens up to show your image files you

2538
01:31:08,870 --> 01:31:06,560
could use it for slideshows you could

2539
01:31:11,350 --> 01:31:08,880
use it to import images from digital

2540
01:31:13,350 --> 01:31:11,360
cameras or from scanners need to do some

2541
01:31:15,910 --> 01:31:13,360
image editing you can do that too in

2542
01:31:18,470 --> 01:31:15,920
graphic inverter also print catalogs

2543
01:31:20,870 --> 01:31:18,480
convert from so many formats i can't

2544
01:31:23,270 --> 01:31:20,880
even list them download now to see if

2545
01:31:26,310 --> 01:31:23,280
graphic inverter is good for you like

2546
01:31:28,229 --> 01:31:26,320
one and a half million other users guess

2547
01:31:30,950 --> 01:31:28,239
what you could save money when you buy

2548
01:31:33,669 --> 01:31:30,960
graphic inverter use the coupon code

2549
01:31:35,669 --> 01:31:33,679
night owl use the coupon code nighthow

2550
01:31:37,149 --> 01:31:35,679
to get a special price for graphic

2551
01:31:40,830 --> 01:31:37,159
inverter go to

2552
01:31:42,830 --> 01:31:40,840
lemkesoft.com that's l e m k e

2553
01:31:47,990 --> 01:31:42,840
soft.com

2554
01:31:51,430 --> 01:31:49,510
this is dan pillett do you have the irs

2555
01:31:53,270 --> 01:31:51,440
money you can't pay are tax debts

2556
01:31:55,590 --> 01:31:53,280
crippling you i've defended people from

2557
01:31:57,669 --> 01:31:55,600
the irs for over 30 years i've helped

2558
01:31:59,110 --> 01:31:57,679
thousands and i can help you too i wrote

2559
01:32:00,790 --> 01:31:59,120
the book on irs settlement and i'm

2560
01:32:04,470 --> 01:32:00,800
telling you there's no such thing as a

2561
01:32:06,709 --> 01:32:04,480
hopeless case call 834 no tax to finally

2562
01:32:08,229 --> 01:32:06,719
get free of irs debt with the irs's new

2563
01:32:11,110 --> 01:32:08,239
programs there's never been a better

2564
01:32:14,950 --> 01:32:11,120
time to solve your problem call 834 no

2565
01:32:17,110 --> 01:32:14,960
tax that's 800 34 no tax on my website

2566
01:32:18,790 --> 01:32:17,120
danpilla.com

2567
01:32:20,709 --> 01:32:18,800
there's nothing more enticing and

2568
01:32:23,030 --> 01:32:20,719
intoxicating than the finest meat

2569
01:32:25,750 --> 01:32:23,040
cooking on an open flame freeze-dried

2570
01:32:28,550 --> 01:32:25,760
meat from newharvest.com is u.s grown

2571
01:32:30,550 --> 01:32:28,560
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2572
01:32:32,149 --> 01:32:30,560
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2573
01:32:34,229 --> 01:32:32,159
chicken guaranteed to stay fresh and

2574
01:32:36,070 --> 01:32:34,239
delicious add new harvest freeze-dried

2575
01:32:37,910 --> 01:32:36,080
meats to your current food storage

2576
01:32:39,990 --> 01:32:37,920
you'll buy direct from the factory not a

2577
01:32:42,149 --> 01:32:40,000
third party ensuring the best price and

2578
01:32:42,750 --> 01:32:42,159
the highest quality see all our products

2579
01:32:51,270 --> 01:32:42,760
at

2580
01:32:52,310 --> 01:32:51,280
polaski of the palestinian law firm with

2581
01:32:53,270 --> 01:32:52,320
principal office and used to texas the

2582
01:32:54,229 --> 01:32:53,280
attorney responsible for the content of

2583
01:32:55,110 --> 01:32:54,239
this ad this ad is not legal of cysts

2584
01:32:56,229 --> 01:32:55,120
and the choice of a lawyer should not be

2585
01:32:57,590 --> 01:32:56,239
based only on advertisement services may

2586
01:32:59,669 --> 01:32:57,600
not be available in all states attention

2587
01:33:01,590 --> 01:32:59,679
zarelto users if you or a loved one took

2588
01:33:03,270 --> 01:33:01,600
xarelto and suffered a serious bleeding

2589
01:33:05,270 --> 01:33:03,280
event you may be entitled to financial

2590
01:33:06,470 --> 01:33:05,280
compensation xaroto is a popular

2591
01:33:08,070 --> 01:33:06,480
prescription blood thinner used to

2592
01:33:09,510 --> 01:33:08,080
prevent blood clots and protect patients

2593
01:33:10,870 --> 01:33:09,520
from strokes these serious bleeding

2594
01:33:12,629 --> 01:33:10,880
events have led to numerous cases of

2595
01:33:15,310 --> 01:33:12,639
hospitalization and even death phone

2596
01:33:20,390 --> 01:33:15,320
lines are open 24 7. call

2597
01:33:24,470 --> 01:33:22,390
are you worried about your mom or dad

2598
01:33:27,110 --> 01:33:24,480
living alone in their house

2599
01:33:29,590 --> 01:33:27,120
hi i'm joan lunden listen i know how

2600
01:33:31,910 --> 01:33:29,600
difficult it is to find senior care for

2601
01:33:34,870 --> 01:33:31,920
someone you love that's why i recommend

2602
01:33:36,790 --> 01:33:34,880
a free service called a place for mom

2603
01:33:38,629 --> 01:33:36,800
they are the nation's largest senior

2604
01:33:40,709 --> 01:33:38,639
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2605
01:33:42,790 --> 01:33:40,719
call a place for mom today

2606
01:33:45,110 --> 01:33:42,800
to receive free information on senior

2607
01:33:50,709 --> 01:33:45,120
living communities in your area call a

2608
01:33:55,830 --> 01:33:53,270
a place for mom offers free one-on-one

2609
01:33:57,910 --> 01:33:55,840
advice from local advisors and a

2610
01:34:00,070 --> 01:33:57,920
personalized list of senior living

2611
01:34:02,310 --> 01:34:00,080
communities you can visit if you have

2612
01:34:04,790 --> 01:34:02,320
questions about senior care for your mom

2613
01:34:06,070 --> 01:34:04,800
or dad there's a place for answers a

2614
01:34:08,870 --> 01:34:06,080
place for mom

2615
01:34:10,709 --> 01:34:08,880
minutes to get your free ebook on

2616
01:34:12,550 --> 01:34:10,719
financing senior care as well as free

2617
01:34:14,830 --> 01:34:12,560
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2618
01:34:18,950 --> 01:34:14,840
in your area call

2619
01:34:21,030 --> 01:34:18,960
1-800-704-6182 that's 1-800-70461

2620
01:34:22,790 --> 01:34:21,040
worried about lead fluoride and other

2621
01:34:25,270 --> 01:34:22,800
contaminants in your drinking water get

2622
01:34:27,669 --> 01:34:25,280
a pro pure with the pro 1g 2.0 cleanable

2623
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2624
01:34:31,669 --> 01:34:29,679
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2625
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meant it to be clean crisp and

2626
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refreshing see the complete line of pro

2627
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2628
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2629
01:34:41,070 --> 01:34:39,600
visit your authorized pro pure dealer

2630
01:34:44,550 --> 01:34:41,080
for details or

2631
01:34:52,890 --> 01:34:44,560
propureusa.com that's p-r-o-p-u-r-u-s-a

2632
01:34:52,900 --> 01:34:59,430
[Music]

2633
01:35:03,669 --> 01:35:01,590
the 800-544-3533 standard of paranormal

2634
01:35:04,950 --> 01:35:03,679
radio

2635
01:35:08,310 --> 01:35:04,960
and now

2636
01:35:11,830 --> 01:35:08,320
here's jane steinberg

2637
01:35:16,550 --> 01:35:14,149
so as we progress towards the two-thirds

2638
01:35:18,790 --> 01:35:16,560
mark of this show with micah hanks of

2639
01:35:20,390 --> 01:35:18,800
the ghrelian report i'm going to ask

2640
01:35:22,390 --> 01:35:20,400
that question again

2641
01:35:25,270 --> 01:35:22,400
so if we're having less

2642
01:35:27,189 --> 01:35:25,280
fewer of these close encounters

2643
01:35:29,189 --> 01:35:27,199
why is that and does that indicate

2644
01:35:31,510 --> 01:35:29,199
possibly that all the other sightings

2645
01:35:34,790 --> 01:35:31,520
might have conventional explanations

2646
01:35:36,149 --> 01:35:34,800
that the ufo phenomenon has left us

2647
01:35:37,990 --> 01:35:36,159
you know it's maybe one of the most

2648
01:35:40,470 --> 01:35:38,000
important questions that can be asked

2649
01:35:42,149 --> 01:35:40,480
today and i realized by the way that you

2650
01:35:44,310 --> 01:35:42,159
know gene you know we're being very

2651
01:35:45,910 --> 01:35:44,320
skeptical and frankly i'm sure in this

2652
01:35:48,390 --> 01:35:45,920
last segment where we were giving all

2653
01:35:49,750 --> 01:35:48,400
these rapid-fire breakdowns of well this

2654
01:35:51,910 --> 01:35:49,760
is why we've changed this and this is

2655
01:35:53,990 --> 01:35:51,920
why i've instituted what i call a new

2656
01:35:55,910 --> 01:35:54,000
classification system a stripped-down

2657
01:35:57,189 --> 01:35:55,920
new approach i realize some people's

2658
01:35:58,709 --> 01:35:57,199
eyes are probably glazing over and

2659
01:36:00,870 --> 01:35:58,719
they're falling asleep because this

2660
01:36:02,790 --> 01:36:00,880
these aren't these meaty juicy

2661
01:36:05,350 --> 01:36:02,800
tantalizing stories of contact with

2662
01:36:06,550 --> 01:36:05,360
aliens and landed craft

2663
01:36:07,750 --> 01:36:06,560
this is the kind of thing that people

2664
01:36:10,070 --> 01:36:07,760
like to hear but if we're really

2665
01:36:11,590 --> 01:36:10,080
seriously trying to study ufos and we're

2666
01:36:13,030 --> 01:36:11,600
not just trying to be storytellers

2667
01:36:14,390 --> 01:36:13,040
around a campfire

2668
01:36:16,790 --> 01:36:14,400
sometimes we have to break away from

2669
01:36:18,950 --> 01:36:16,800
those juicy stories but sometimes we

2670
01:36:20,790 --> 01:36:18,960
have to step away from you know the

2671
01:36:22,629 --> 01:36:20,800
literature that seeks to entertain and

2672
01:36:24,070 --> 01:36:22,639
thrill rather than really understand and

2673
01:36:26,550 --> 01:36:24,080
that's what we're trying to do here and

2674
01:36:28,629 --> 01:36:26,560
so for the serious minded ufo enthusiast

2675
01:36:29,830 --> 01:36:28,639
or podcast listener for that matter

2676
01:36:31,430 --> 01:36:29,840
that's what we're trying to break down

2677
01:36:34,070 --> 01:36:31,440
right now and so i'll make no apologies

2678
01:36:35,910 --> 01:36:34,080
for at times having to get really

2679
01:36:37,510 --> 01:36:35,920
detailed with the scientific

2680
01:36:38,470 --> 01:36:37,520
interpretation now coming back to your

2681
01:36:39,590 --> 01:36:38,480
question

2682
01:36:42,149 --> 01:36:39,600
because this is exactly what we're

2683
01:36:44,310 --> 01:36:42,159
talking about you know a study

2684
01:36:46,709 --> 01:36:44,320
in which these kind of juicy reports are

2685
01:36:48,709 --> 01:36:46,719
lacking because in the culture present

2686
01:36:49,990 --> 01:36:48,719
today there are fewer of them

2687
01:36:51,830 --> 01:36:50,000
and i think maybe it's time that we do

2688
01:36:54,229 --> 01:36:51,840
look at things scientifically but why do

2689
01:36:55,990 --> 01:36:54,239
we see less today why are there you know

2690
01:36:57,189 --> 01:36:56,000
fewer cases that involve landed craft

2691
01:36:59,350 --> 01:36:57,199
that people approach and suddenly

2692
01:37:00,950 --> 01:36:59,360
they've been burned after you know a

2693
01:37:02,550 --> 01:37:00,960
gust of heat is blasted out of this

2694
01:37:04,310 --> 01:37:02,560
thing as the door shuts and it takes off

2695
01:37:05,750 --> 01:37:04,320
into the sky why are fewer people you

2696
01:37:07,510 --> 01:37:05,760
know lifted off the ground and knocked

2697
01:37:09,189 --> 01:37:07,520
out and found aboard a craft in which

2698
01:37:11,830 --> 01:37:09,199
they're surrounded by strange

2699
01:37:13,189 --> 01:37:11,840
human-esque beings why do we have fewer

2700
01:37:15,270 --> 01:37:13,199
of these kind of cases why do why do we

2701
01:37:17,270 --> 01:37:15,280
have fewer people who are coming forward

2702
01:37:20,070 --> 01:37:17,280
with nighttime encounters saying yeah i

2703
01:37:21,430 --> 01:37:20,080
too have been one of the abducted what

2704
01:37:22,950 --> 01:37:21,440
is changing it's interesting we could

2705
01:37:24,229 --> 01:37:22,960
look at it in a number of ways let's

2706
01:37:25,990 --> 01:37:24,239
first look at it in terms of an

2707
01:37:27,109 --> 01:37:26,000
extraterrestrial phenomena because i

2708
01:37:29,510 --> 01:37:27,119
think it's fair to do that whether or

2709
01:37:31,430 --> 01:37:29,520
not i endorse that idea i'm open to that

2710
01:37:33,430 --> 01:37:31,440
possibility as many i think skeptically

2711
01:37:35,430 --> 01:37:33,440
minded ufo researchers would be if we

2712
01:37:37,030 --> 01:37:35,440
have good evidence that is forthcoming

2713
01:37:39,910 --> 01:37:37,040
i'm happy to say okay if that's the most

2714
01:37:41,750 --> 01:37:39,920
likely interpretation e.t it is but the

2715
01:37:43,669 --> 01:37:41,760
thing is is that i think that um if we

2716
01:37:44,870 --> 01:37:43,679
were to deal with an et phenomena and

2717
01:37:46,390 --> 01:37:44,880
let's say that immediately after the

2718
01:37:48,870 --> 01:37:46,400
second world war they'd been here all

2719
01:37:51,189 --> 01:37:48,880
along as valet and and many of the

2720
01:37:52,550 --> 01:37:51,199
modern ancient alien theorists have even

2721
01:37:54,550 --> 01:37:52,560
uh argued

2722
01:37:56,390 --> 01:37:54,560
maybe after the second world war and our

2723
01:37:58,870 --> 01:37:56,400
enter our humankind's entry into the

2724
01:38:00,470 --> 01:37:58,880
nuclear era it really was a beacon and

2725
01:38:03,030 --> 01:38:00,480
it really garners their attention they

2726
01:38:04,870 --> 01:38:03,040
come down they say okay now these guys

2727
01:38:06,629 --> 01:38:04,880
the kid gloves are off you know now

2728
01:38:09,189 --> 01:38:06,639
they're playing for keeps so they they

2729
01:38:11,109 --> 01:38:09,199
come to earth maybe there's not just one

2730
01:38:13,030 --> 01:38:11,119
group maybe there's not just one

2731
01:38:14,950 --> 01:38:13,040
civilization let's say that this is a

2732
01:38:16,870 --> 01:38:14,960
hypothetical so follow me here let's say

2733
01:38:18,870 --> 01:38:16,880
they are descending on earth the

2734
01:38:20,070 --> 01:38:18,880
intergalactic federation you know people

2735
01:38:21,430 --> 01:38:20,080
you know from all different parts of the

2736
01:38:23,189 --> 01:38:21,440
galaxy you're coming here people i say

2737
01:38:25,189 --> 01:38:23,199
but aliens and scent you know they're

2738
01:38:27,189 --> 01:38:25,199
coming down they're taking soil samples

2739
01:38:29,109 --> 01:38:27,199
they're you know taking people they're

2740
01:38:30,790 --> 01:38:29,119
examining things they're checking out

2741
01:38:32,790 --> 01:38:30,800
our you know weapons installations

2742
01:38:34,950 --> 01:38:32,800
they're checking out our nuclear plants

2743
01:38:37,990 --> 01:38:34,960
and they spend several decades

2744
01:38:40,229 --> 01:38:38,000
involved in various different kinds of

2745
01:38:41,590 --> 01:38:40,239
of investigative work here on earth and

2746
01:38:43,669 --> 01:38:41,600
they make their assessment and the

2747
01:38:45,830 --> 01:38:43,679
different nations in the united nations

2748
01:38:48,629 --> 01:38:45,840
of alien civilization

2749
01:38:50,390 --> 01:38:48,639
of course we call that the federation

2750
01:38:52,070 --> 01:38:50,400
yes

2751
01:38:53,910 --> 01:38:52,080
in this hypothetical structure we do

2752
01:38:55,189 --> 01:38:53,920
yeah and as they go back and they all

2753
01:38:57,430 --> 01:38:55,199
file their reports and the different

2754
01:38:59,430 --> 01:38:57,440
nations compare and they do exactly what

2755
01:39:01,270 --> 01:38:59,440
we here on earth essentially do with our

2756
01:39:02,709 --> 01:39:01,280
international politics they present

2757
01:39:04,310 --> 01:39:02,719
their reports and they say well our best

2758
01:39:06,550 --> 01:39:04,320
assessment is that these people aren't

2759
01:39:07,910 --> 01:39:06,560
really close enough yet to getting off

2760
01:39:09,669 --> 01:39:07,920
their mud ball and bringing these

2761
01:39:11,270 --> 01:39:09,679
dangers to us that we should worry yet

2762
01:39:12,709 --> 01:39:11,280
so we'll leave them alone for a while

2763
01:39:15,189 --> 01:39:12,719
and there's been a marked decrease and

2764
01:39:17,030 --> 01:39:15,199
over the last few years we see fewer

2765
01:39:18,790 --> 01:39:17,040
instances of abductions and encounters

2766
01:39:20,390 --> 01:39:18,800
and interactions because maybe well

2767
01:39:22,629 --> 01:39:20,400
there's been less interest by the

2768
01:39:23,830 --> 01:39:22,639
so-called operators of these ufo craft

2769
01:39:25,669 --> 01:39:23,840
now i know that sounds like something

2770
01:39:27,669 --> 01:39:25,679
out of a sci-fi movie and i intend it to

2771
01:39:29,750 --> 01:39:27,679
be because maybe that for all we know is

2772
01:39:31,669 --> 01:39:29,760
what's actually going on and when i've

2773
01:39:33,669 --> 01:39:31,679
heard people like valet in the past

2774
01:39:36,709 --> 01:39:33,679
argue that there's far more going on

2775
01:39:38,950 --> 01:39:36,719
with ufo phenomena to account for a

2776
01:39:41,189 --> 01:39:38,960
scientific investigation being carried

2777
01:39:43,510 --> 01:39:41,199
out by an alien species i say well which

2778
01:39:45,669 --> 01:39:43,520
alien species and how many if these were

2779
01:39:48,390 --> 01:39:45,679
extraterrestrial aliens who is to say it

2780
01:39:50,390 --> 01:39:48,400
was all just one that was carrying out

2781
01:39:52,870 --> 01:39:50,400
these activities on earth you know if

2782
01:39:54,149 --> 01:39:52,880
there were multiple different et groups

2783
01:39:56,950 --> 01:39:54,159
that have been doing this kind of thing

2784
01:39:58,310 --> 01:39:56,960
i mean sure the body of ufo literature

2785
01:40:01,590 --> 01:39:58,320
especially that was collected between

2786
01:40:03,430 --> 01:40:01,600
the 50s 60s and 70s might account for

2787
01:40:05,470 --> 01:40:03,440
that scientific investigation and who

2788
01:40:07,030 --> 01:40:05,480
are we to say with our own

2789
01:40:09,030 --> 01:40:07,040
anthropomorphization i guess of the

2790
01:40:11,510 --> 01:40:09,040
phenomena that we would understand the

2791
01:40:13,109 --> 01:40:11,520
motives and the necessities of alien

2792
01:40:14,709 --> 01:40:13,119
science you know so i'm not trying to

2793
01:40:16,149 --> 01:40:14,719
debunk ballet but i am trying to say

2794
01:40:17,350 --> 01:40:16,159
that i think that we need to be very

2795
01:40:19,109 --> 01:40:17,360
careful that we haven't allowed

2796
01:40:21,350 --> 01:40:19,119
ourselves to project our own

2797
01:40:24,149 --> 01:40:21,360
expectations of science onto an alien

2798
01:40:26,070 --> 01:40:24,159
species now coming back to the anti-et

2799
01:40:27,510 --> 01:40:26,080
argument though i mean really despite

2800
01:40:28,950 --> 01:40:27,520
all the conjecture i've just presented

2801
01:40:31,669 --> 01:40:28,960
there is really no good evidence that

2802
01:40:33,350 --> 01:40:31,679
e.t is at the at the

2803
01:40:34,950 --> 01:40:33,360
source of all this phenomena it could be

2804
01:40:36,790 --> 01:40:34,960
any number of things in equal measure

2805
01:40:38,310 --> 01:40:36,800
based on the scant data that we have

2806
01:40:40,629 --> 01:40:38,320
before us so let's look at it as a

2807
01:40:41,990 --> 01:40:40,639
social cultural thing gene i mean if

2808
01:40:43,430 --> 01:40:42,000
it's something that culturally is

2809
01:40:45,590 --> 01:40:43,440
changing i have to point out initially

2810
01:40:48,229 --> 01:40:45,600
what comes to mind is that as ufo

2811
01:40:50,550 --> 01:40:48,239
sightings and contact t and abductee

2812
01:40:51,709 --> 01:40:50,560
reports seem to diminish with time

2813
01:40:53,830 --> 01:40:51,719
there seems to be an inverse

2814
01:40:56,149 --> 01:40:53,840
proportionality that appears with the

2815
01:40:58,470 --> 01:40:56,159
growth in our technology and as we

2816
01:41:01,270 --> 01:40:58,480
become more technologically advanced and

2817
01:41:03,510 --> 01:41:01,280
as perhaps in an insidious way the

2818
01:41:05,030 --> 01:41:03,520
advancement of technology works steadily

2819
01:41:07,669 --> 01:41:05,040
more into our lives with wi-fi

2820
01:41:10,149 --> 01:41:07,679
smartphones gpes i mean

2821
01:41:12,790 --> 01:41:10,159
surveillance all of these kind of things

2822
01:41:14,550 --> 01:41:12,800
as we are ever more trending toward a

2823
01:41:16,070 --> 01:41:14,560
technologically proficient society and

2824
01:41:17,910 --> 01:41:16,080
it immerses itself in our lives and

2825
01:41:20,390 --> 01:41:17,920
culture we do see a marked decline in

2826
01:41:23,669 --> 01:41:20,400
ufos proportionally so could it be that

2827
01:41:25,669 --> 01:41:23,679
technology and our own intelligence as

2828
01:41:27,270 --> 01:41:25,679
it relates to technological growth are

2829
01:41:29,109 --> 01:41:27,280
these things affecting interest in and

2830
01:41:30,390 --> 01:41:29,119
perception of ufos

2831
01:41:31,510 --> 01:41:30,400
you know there are any number of ways it

2832
01:41:33,430 --> 01:41:31,520
might be interpreted but i think that

2833
01:41:35,030 --> 01:41:33,440
the point is that one has to note that

2834
01:41:37,189 --> 01:41:35,040
it certainly has changed we don't have

2835
01:41:39,030 --> 01:41:37,199
the kind of hairy dwarf reports that

2836
01:41:41,109 --> 01:41:39,040
were once present in the april journals

2837
01:41:43,750 --> 01:41:41,119
and things and it's really perplexing to

2838
01:41:46,629 --> 01:41:43,760
me well this of course is a serious

2839
01:41:49,830 --> 01:41:46,639
question with regard to the ufo mystery

2840
01:41:52,870 --> 01:41:49,840
has e.t left us but that presupposes

2841
01:41:54,310 --> 01:41:52,880
there is an et and that et actually came

2842
01:41:57,590 --> 01:41:54,320
here to

2843
01:41:59,830 --> 01:41:57,600
perform some kind of scientific research

2844
01:42:01,189 --> 01:41:59,840
right it may just be that our culture

2845
01:42:03,590 --> 01:42:01,199
has moved on

2846
01:42:05,750 --> 01:42:03,600
and we expect different things now

2847
01:42:08,390 --> 01:42:05,760
yes yeah that is certainly i think

2848
01:42:09,669 --> 01:42:08,400
something that's worthy of of you know

2849
01:42:12,390 --> 01:42:09,679
considering

2850
01:42:14,390 --> 01:42:12,400
i mean has the entire ufo meme see i

2851
01:42:17,669 --> 01:42:14,400
don't doubt that there's a phenomenon

2852
01:42:18,709 --> 01:42:17,679
and i i saw one of the uh the bloggers a

2853
01:42:20,550 --> 01:42:18,719
while back

2854
01:42:21,510 --> 01:42:20,560
saying it's time that we go ahead and we

2855
01:42:25,030 --> 01:42:21,520
just

2856
01:42:26,629 --> 01:42:25,040
know valet has said what if there's a

2857
01:42:28,790 --> 01:42:26,639
control mechanism what if there's

2858
01:42:31,030 --> 01:42:28,800
something that is you know

2859
01:42:33,030 --> 01:42:31,040
even on a subversive level

2860
01:42:35,030 --> 01:42:33,040
uh subconsciously controlling and

2861
01:42:36,790 --> 01:42:35,040
changing and maybe even causing sort of

2862
01:42:37,910 --> 01:42:36,800
a conscious evolution

2863
01:42:39,350 --> 01:42:37,920
you know we just have to accept that

2864
01:42:41,030 --> 01:42:39,360
valet was wrong and i remember reading

2865
01:42:42,950 --> 01:42:41,040
that blog and saying ah but is that

2866
01:42:45,430 --> 01:42:42,960
really accurate

2867
01:42:48,070 --> 01:42:45,440
i would say that really with or without

2868
01:42:49,510 --> 01:42:48,080
an actual ufo phenomena let's say the

2869
01:42:53,750 --> 01:42:49,520
entire thing can be chalked up to

2870
01:42:58,390 --> 01:42:55,350
if that were the case

2871
01:43:00,550 --> 01:42:58,400
the concept of alien life and ufos

2872
01:43:01,830 --> 01:43:00,560
have nonetheless had an incredible

2873
01:43:04,229 --> 01:43:01,840
effect

2874
01:43:05,669 --> 01:43:04,239
on our uh culture

2875
01:43:06,709 --> 01:43:05,679
and i think the development of our

2876
01:43:07,910 --> 01:43:06,719
psyche

2877
01:43:09,830 --> 01:43:07,920
i mean i would argue that you know the

2878
01:43:11,590 --> 01:43:09,840
idea of beings traveling here from other

2879
01:43:12,709 --> 01:43:11,600
star systems has been the number one

2880
01:43:14,629 --> 01:43:12,719
propellant

2881
01:43:15,910 --> 01:43:14,639
force behind engineering that has gotten

2882
01:43:17,430 --> 01:43:15,920
us to the moon and which eventually will

2883
01:43:19,350 --> 01:43:17,440
carry us to other planets and further

2884
01:43:20,550 --> 01:43:19,360
out into the stars

2885
01:43:22,229 --> 01:43:20,560
you know i mean i think that every

2886
01:43:23,750 --> 01:43:22,239
person who has ever been involved in

2887
01:43:25,590 --> 01:43:23,760
engineering as it relates to the space

2888
01:43:27,669 --> 01:43:25,600
program or with the independent space

2889
01:43:29,910 --> 01:43:27,679
programs like spacex you know elon musk

2890
01:43:32,229 --> 01:43:29,920
and and others ever more we are seeing

2891
01:43:33,510 --> 01:43:32,239
that as we perfect technologies that

2892
01:43:36,149 --> 01:43:33,520
will carry us further out into the

2893
01:43:37,990 --> 01:43:36,159
cosmos these people had to have at some

2894
01:43:39,350 --> 01:43:38,000
point come across the idea of the notion

2895
01:43:41,590 --> 01:43:39,360
that there are other civilizations that

2896
01:43:42,950 --> 01:43:41,600
are doing it out there and it what we

2897
01:43:44,550 --> 01:43:42,960
see is that rather than just you know

2898
01:43:46,790 --> 01:43:44,560
kicking around you know sticks and

2899
01:43:49,430 --> 01:43:46,800
stones at one another and building fires

2900
01:43:53,270 --> 01:43:49,440
you know as our ancient ancestors did

2901
01:43:56,629 --> 01:43:53,280
our imaginations fuel the engineering

2902
01:43:58,950 --> 01:43:56,639
innovate innovations of tomorrow and one

2903
01:44:00,870 --> 01:43:58,960
could argue that the ufo culture and

2904
01:44:03,669 --> 01:44:00,880
belief in it and literature associated

2905
01:44:06,229 --> 01:44:03,679
with it has in many ways influenced our

2906
01:44:07,910 --> 01:44:06,239
technological growth as a civilization

2907
01:44:09,030 --> 01:44:07,920
here on earth so i think that really

2908
01:44:10,870 --> 01:44:09,040
valet

2909
01:44:12,310 --> 01:44:10,880
really in a sense was spot on in the

2910
01:44:15,189 --> 01:44:12,320
sense that with or without there being a

2911
01:44:17,189 --> 01:44:15,199
phenomena it certainly has in a way

2912
01:44:20,390 --> 01:44:17,199
helped steer our development and our

2913
01:44:23,030 --> 01:44:20,400
interests and it is still doing so today

2914
01:44:25,350 --> 01:44:23,040
flying saucers are here to make us think

2915
01:44:27,270 --> 01:44:25,360
as i've said for many years

2916
01:44:29,910 --> 01:44:27,280
so having made us think about the

2917
01:44:31,669 --> 01:44:29,920
possibility of life in outer space

2918
01:44:33,590 --> 01:44:31,679
they've done their deed

2919
01:44:35,189 --> 01:44:33,600
we are now discovering the possible

2920
01:44:38,149 --> 01:44:35,199
presence of

2921
01:44:39,109 --> 01:44:38,159
extrasolar planets possible life-bearing

2922
01:44:41,030 --> 01:44:39,119
planets

2923
01:44:44,629 --> 01:44:41,040
we're still moving along in the space

2924
01:44:47,350 --> 01:44:44,639
program in fact elon musk of spacex

2925
01:44:49,590 --> 01:44:47,360
is saying he plans to send an unmanned

2926
01:44:51,430 --> 01:44:49,600
rocket ship to mars

2927
01:44:54,229 --> 01:44:51,440
in 2018

2928
01:44:56,390 --> 01:44:54,239
far ahead of nasa's plans

2929
01:44:58,550 --> 01:44:56,400
and where does that take us next well to

2930
01:45:01,270 --> 01:44:58,560
the possibility of if we can send the

2931
01:45:05,510 --> 01:45:01,280
spaceship there and it succeeds what

2932
01:45:07,750 --> 01:45:05,520
about sending humans to mars by 2020

2933
01:45:09,350 --> 01:45:07,760
which is quite a bit faster than what

2934
01:45:12,590 --> 01:45:09,360
nasa's talking about in a very

2935
01:45:15,750 --> 01:45:12,600
disappointing estimate of the

2936
01:45:23,240 --> 01:45:15,760
2030s more to come with micah hanks and

2937
01:45:23,250 --> 01:45:30,070
[Music]

2938
01:45:34,830 --> 01:45:33,510
thank you for listening to gcn

2939
01:45:37,590 --> 01:45:34,840
be sure to visit

2940
01:45:39,350 --> 01:45:37,600
gcnlive.com today

2941
01:45:41,350 --> 01:45:39,360
first game attack of the rockoids and it

2942
01:45:42,709 --> 01:45:41,360
was a critically acclaimed success and

2943
01:45:44,629 --> 01:45:42,719
now there is the coming of the

2944
01:45:46,790 --> 01:45:44,639
protectors a former military

2945
01:45:49,030 --> 01:45:46,800
intelligence man is contacted by a space

2946
01:45:51,590 --> 01:45:49,040
woman in a dream a dream that turns out

2947
01:45:53,189 --> 01:45:51,600
to be a nightmare because evil forces on

2948
01:45:55,430 --> 01:45:53,199
her distant planet are planning to

2949
01:45:57,990 --> 01:45:55,440
conquer the earth this is gripping

2950
01:45:59,830 --> 01:45:58,000
science fiction of the classic kind

2951
01:46:01,870 --> 01:45:59,840
attack of the rockoids and the coming of

2952
01:46:04,750 --> 01:46:01,880
the protectors find out more at

2953
01:46:07,189 --> 01:46:04,760
rockoaids.com that's rockoids

2954
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2955
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2956
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2959
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2966
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2967
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2968
01:46:47,590 --> 01:46:44,719
hundreds of dollars a year a woman named

2969
01:46:50,629 --> 01:46:47,600
linda just called her husband ray has a

2970
01:46:52,550 --> 01:46:50,639
300 000 group life insurance policy but

2971
01:46:55,030 --> 01:46:52,560
is changing jobs and can't take it with

2972
01:46:56,790 --> 01:46:55,040
him well i am partially shot the highly

2973
01:46:59,510 --> 01:46:56,800
rated term life insurance companies we

2974
01:47:00,950 --> 01:46:59,520
represent and found ray who is 41 and

2975
01:47:04,709 --> 01:47:00,960
takes medication to control his

2976
01:47:07,910 --> 01:47:04,719
cholesterol a 10-year 500 000 policy for

2977
01:47:09,990 --> 01:47:07,920
under 26 a month that's almost twice the

2978
01:47:12,070 --> 01:47:10,000
coverage for less than half of what he

2979
01:47:14,070 --> 01:47:12,080
had paid if select quote hasn't shopped

2980
01:47:15,510 --> 01:47:14,080
for your life insurance you're probably

2981
01:47:20,709 --> 01:47:15,520
paying too much

2982
01:47:24,870 --> 01:47:23,700
that's 1-800-403-4885

2983
01:47:28,629 --> 01:47:24,880
[Music]

2984
01:47:33,990 --> 01:47:32,229
or go to selectquote.com we shop you

2985
01:47:34,830 --> 01:47:34,000
save get full details in the example

2986
01:47:35,750 --> 01:47:34,840
policy at

2987
01:47:36,629 --> 01:47:35,760
slowpoke.com commercials your price

2988
01:47:37,910 --> 01:47:36,639
could vary depending on your health

2989
01:47:42,330 --> 01:47:37,920
issue and company and other factors not

2990
01:47:42,340 --> 01:47:46,229
[Music]

2991
01:47:53,109 --> 01:47:49,430
welcome back to the paracast the gold

2992
01:47:54,390 --> 01:47:53,119
standard of paranormal radio

2993
01:47:57,730 --> 01:47:54,400
and now

2994
01:48:01,350 --> 01:47:57,740
here's gene steinberg

2995
01:48:06,070 --> 01:48:03,669
you see ladies and gentlemen as i do he

2996
01:48:07,030 --> 01:48:06,080
can create all sorts of strange special

2997
01:48:09,590 --> 01:48:07,040
effects

2998
01:48:10,950 --> 01:48:09,600
using these little buttons

2999
01:48:12,470 --> 01:48:10,960
on our mixer

3000
01:48:14,229 --> 01:48:12,480
is that what you're doing

3001
01:48:15,750 --> 01:48:14,239
oh no that's all natural i can just do

3002
01:48:17,430 --> 01:48:15,760
it with my vocal cords you know because

3003
01:48:19,910 --> 01:48:17,440
my zeta reticulum

3004
01:48:21,910 --> 01:48:19,920
biology is conducive to such things now

3005
01:48:25,109 --> 01:48:21,920
you're a reptilian right gene

3006
01:48:27,750 --> 01:48:25,119
ah i resemble that remark

3007
01:48:29,750 --> 01:48:27,760
you just answered it for me thank you

3008
01:48:32,950 --> 01:48:29,760
i am not a reptilian

3009
01:48:35,430 --> 01:48:32,960
i cannot say what i am or what i am not

3010
01:48:36,310 --> 01:48:35,440
because i do not presume to get into

3011
01:48:38,550 --> 01:48:36,320
that

3012
01:48:41,270 --> 01:48:38,560
now the other possibility here

3013
01:48:42,390 --> 01:48:41,280
and this takes us to another crazy realm

3014
01:48:45,030 --> 01:48:42,400
is that

3015
01:48:47,590 --> 01:48:45,040
ufos are not from outer space they are

3016
01:48:49,750 --> 01:48:47,600
not some kind of psychic phenomenon

3017
01:48:52,470 --> 01:48:49,760
that we perceive on a subconscious level

3018
01:48:54,790 --> 01:48:52,480
and we adapt to being ufos or whatever

3019
01:48:57,990 --> 01:48:54,800
the cultural meme is at the time

3020
01:49:00,550 --> 01:48:58,000
that there are other civilizations

3021
01:49:02,070 --> 01:49:00,560
people human beings or

3022
01:49:05,669 --> 01:49:02,080
intelligent beings

3023
01:49:07,510 --> 01:49:05,679
sharing our planet

3024
01:49:10,470 --> 01:49:07,520
secret

3025
01:49:14,229 --> 01:49:12,070
what do you think

3026
01:49:16,870 --> 01:49:14,239
it's a you know an interesting concept i

3027
01:49:18,149 --> 01:49:16,880
mean um we obviously see and by the way

3028
01:49:19,750 --> 01:49:18,159
actually i came across an interesting

3029
01:49:22,149 --> 01:49:19,760
ufo book the other day that looked at

3030
01:49:24,149 --> 01:49:22,159
some of these beliefs namely as it

3031
01:49:26,310 --> 01:49:24,159
relates to the so-called shaver mystery

3032
01:49:28,149 --> 01:49:26,320
which we'll revisit here in a moment but

3033
01:49:29,590 --> 01:49:28,159
i'm someone who has so many books in my

3034
01:49:33,109 --> 01:49:29,600
collection that sometimes i forget or

3035
01:49:34,870 --> 01:49:33,119
don't even fully know what books i own

3036
01:49:36,149 --> 01:49:34,880
and i was pouring over some in my

3037
01:49:37,830 --> 01:49:36,159
bookshelf the other day and found a book

3038
01:49:39,510 --> 01:49:37,840
by donald menzel

3039
01:49:41,990 --> 01:49:39,520
who had really been before class one of

3040
01:49:43,830 --> 01:49:42,000
the arts ufo skeptics of his day and

3041
01:49:45,990 --> 01:49:43,840
nonetheless who also had an affinity for

3042
01:49:47,990 --> 01:49:46,000
sitting around doodling uh various kinds

3043
01:49:50,310 --> 01:49:48,000
of alien life forms so

3044
01:49:52,070 --> 01:49:50,320
a pretty interesting little anecdote but

3045
01:49:55,030 --> 01:49:52,080
in this book that he'd written

3046
01:49:56,950 --> 01:49:55,040
on flying saucers back in the old days

3047
01:49:58,550 --> 01:49:56,960
menzel had addressed the shaver mystery

3048
01:50:00,790 --> 01:49:58,560
and there are a lot of different beliefs

3049
01:50:02,950 --> 01:50:00,800
about uh what you might call and what

3050
01:50:05,910 --> 01:50:02,960
maktani's the late mctonies had called

3051
01:50:07,430 --> 01:50:05,920
cryptoterrestrial civilizations let me

3052
01:50:10,229 --> 01:50:07,440
just tell everybody

3053
01:50:12,149 --> 01:50:10,239
a lot of our listeners know maybe those

3054
01:50:16,149 --> 01:50:12,159
who are new to the show don't

3055
01:50:18,629 --> 01:50:16,159
that in the 60s and 70s until his death

3056
01:50:22,390 --> 01:50:18,639
i knew richard shaver one time i even

3057
01:50:23,590 --> 01:50:22,400
visited him at his cottage in arkansas

3058
01:50:27,430 --> 01:50:23,600
wow

3059
01:50:29,910 --> 01:50:27,440
okay i knew palmer i knew shaver

3060
01:50:31,750 --> 01:50:29,920
so isn't that weird anyway tell us what

3061
01:50:34,310 --> 01:50:31,760
did donald menzel

3062
01:50:36,390 --> 01:50:34,320
a harvard astronomer by the way

3063
01:50:38,709 --> 01:50:36,400
say about richard shaver

3064
01:50:40,149 --> 01:50:38,719
well he of course i think broke it down

3065
01:50:41,910 --> 01:50:40,159
and uh you know made the case that

3066
01:50:43,750 --> 01:50:41,920
shaver was probably

3067
01:50:45,990 --> 01:50:43,760
hallucinating or building off of

3068
01:50:47,270 --> 01:50:46,000
hallucinations or was purely just being

3069
01:50:48,790 --> 01:50:47,280
imaginative

3070
01:50:51,910 --> 01:50:48,800
and i don't think that that's an unfair

3071
01:50:54,470 --> 01:50:51,920
assessment um as a brief anecdote about

3072
01:50:55,990 --> 01:50:54,480
menzel it had never been um apparent to

3073
01:50:57,430 --> 01:50:56,000
me that there was information that isn't

3074
01:50:59,189 --> 01:50:57,440
very well publicly discussed about

3075
01:51:00,390 --> 01:50:59,199
menzel but in fact

3076
01:51:02,390 --> 01:51:00,400
behind the scenes there seems to be

3077
01:51:03,990 --> 01:51:02,400
quite a bit of legitimate uh information

3078
01:51:05,910 --> 01:51:04,000
about and that is the fact that he held

3079
01:51:06,790 --> 01:51:05,920
numerous top secret clearances over the

3080
01:51:08,390 --> 01:51:06,800
years

3081
01:51:09,910 --> 01:51:08,400
uh stanton friedman had been the one who

3082
01:51:11,830 --> 01:51:09,920
pointed it out to me

3083
01:51:12,950 --> 01:51:11,840
and uh and i said i stand and i've never

3084
01:51:15,430 --> 01:51:12,960
heard that and he says wow you need to

3085
01:51:17,590 --> 01:51:15,440
read my book and so

3086
01:51:20,390 --> 01:51:17,600
oh boy we now have an imitation of

3087
01:51:22,149 --> 01:51:20,400
stanton friedman

3088
01:51:24,470 --> 01:51:22,159
yes and it's meant lovingly by the way

3089
01:51:25,830 --> 01:51:24,480
he's a great guy but uh so he uh

3090
01:51:27,510 --> 01:51:25,840
he was standing there with me in

3091
01:51:29,430 --> 01:51:27,520
california and um

3092
01:51:31,270 --> 01:51:29,440
we had a lengthy talk about this but i

3093
01:51:33,270 --> 01:51:31,280
grabbed a copy of a number of his books

3094
01:51:35,350 --> 01:51:33,280
and in his book top secret magic

3095
01:51:36,070 --> 01:51:35,360
whatever one seems to think about mj-12

3096
01:51:37,189 --> 01:51:36,080
you know

3097
01:51:38,390 --> 01:51:37,199
and i'll tell you this too gene

3098
01:51:40,629 --> 01:51:38,400
interestingly

3099
01:51:42,950 --> 01:51:40,639
while uh stanton is always cited as

3100
01:51:44,790 --> 01:51:42,960
being one of the staunchest defenders of

3101
01:51:46,950 --> 01:51:44,800
mj12 and he has

3102
01:51:48,709 --> 01:51:46,960
uh when we were at lunch together in

3103
01:51:50,709 --> 01:51:48,719
riverside california i'd say but come on

3104
01:51:52,470 --> 01:51:50,719
some of these documents you gotta know

3105
01:51:54,310 --> 01:51:52,480
stanton i mean you've gotta admit they

3106
01:51:56,149 --> 01:51:54,320
they're probably uh fabricated and he

3107
01:51:58,470 --> 01:51:56,159
says oh of course they are they're of

3108
01:52:00,310 --> 01:51:58,480
course some of them are fake but not all

3109
01:52:03,270 --> 01:52:00,320
of the information in them mj-12

3110
01:52:05,750 --> 01:52:03,280
documents is fake so and one important

3111
01:52:08,229 --> 01:52:05,760
point he makes is that indeed through

3112
01:52:09,589 --> 01:52:08,239
his own records um and documents that he

3113
01:52:11,669 --> 01:52:09,599
recovered partially through the national

3114
01:52:13,109 --> 01:52:11,679
archives stanton did find mention of the

3115
01:52:15,430 --> 01:52:13,119
fact that um

3116
01:52:17,589 --> 01:52:15,440
menzel had held top secret clearance

3117
01:52:18,870 --> 01:52:17,599
which in stanton's mind substantiates

3118
01:52:20,870 --> 01:52:18,880
the idea that he could have been a part

3119
01:52:22,229 --> 01:52:20,880
of the so-called mj-12 group now we

3120
01:52:23,430 --> 01:52:22,239
won't go down that rabbit hole right now

3121
01:52:25,189 --> 01:52:23,440
i'm merely pointing out that it's

3122
01:52:26,870 --> 01:52:25,199
interesting that in other literature

3123
01:52:29,270 --> 01:52:26,880
that fact i've noticed isn't just

3124
01:52:31,189 --> 01:52:29,280
downplayed it's often completely glossed

3125
01:52:33,910 --> 01:52:31,199
over or not mentioned at all that menzel

3126
01:52:35,830 --> 01:52:33,920
had held a clearance and so this fellow

3127
01:52:37,669 --> 01:52:35,840
yes he had also been a quite the ufo

3128
01:52:38,790 --> 01:52:37,679
skeptic back in his day as far as the

3129
01:52:40,149 --> 01:52:38,800
shaver mystery and what he said about

3130
01:52:41,990 --> 01:52:40,159
that of course he downplayed the idea

3131
01:52:43,510 --> 01:52:42,000
but i bring it all up here because

3132
01:52:44,950 --> 01:52:43,520
shaver i think was the first who tried

3133
01:52:46,790 --> 01:52:44,960
to propose that there was some sort of

3134
01:52:48,550 --> 01:52:46,800
an earthly presence

3135
01:52:50,070 --> 01:52:48,560
and in the mind of ray palmer the

3136
01:52:51,990 --> 01:52:50,080
publisher of amazing stories and who

3137
01:52:53,430 --> 01:52:52,000
went on to found fate but then it was

3138
01:52:56,870 --> 01:52:53,440
handed over pretty promptly i think to

3139
01:52:59,669 --> 01:52:56,880
curtis fuller he and curtis fuller both

3140
01:53:01,910 --> 01:52:59,679
founded fate magazine palmer in the

3141
01:53:03,669 --> 01:53:01,920
early days ran it under the pseudonym

3142
01:53:05,669 --> 01:53:03,679
robert n webster

3143
01:53:06,470 --> 01:53:05,679
and because both he

3144
01:53:08,790 --> 01:53:06,480
and

3145
01:53:10,790 --> 01:53:08,800
curtis fuller were employed

3146
01:53:12,790 --> 01:53:10,800
by zeph davis they didn't want to get

3147
01:53:14,709 --> 01:53:12,800
out that they had this other magazine

3148
01:53:16,790 --> 01:53:14,719
going because i can certainly see it

3149
01:53:18,149 --> 01:53:16,800
might violate an employment agreement or

3150
01:53:20,950 --> 01:53:18,159
something like that

3151
01:53:23,750 --> 01:53:20,960
so that's the reason but they both

3152
01:53:26,550 --> 01:53:23,760
control the product however later on

3153
01:53:29,109 --> 01:53:26,560
palmer withdrew his participation

3154
01:53:30,310 --> 01:53:29,119
do you know why gene why palmer got out

3155
01:53:32,709 --> 01:53:30,320
by the way

3156
01:53:34,229 --> 01:53:32,719
well i think he really wanted to go off

3157
01:53:35,830 --> 01:53:34,239
and do his own thing

3158
01:53:37,589 --> 01:53:35,840
which is essentially what he ended up

3159
01:53:40,229 --> 01:53:37,599
doing i mean it's more complicated than

3160
01:53:41,350 --> 01:53:40,239
that and if you want to know there are

3161
01:53:43,430 --> 01:53:41,360
several

3162
01:53:44,709 --> 01:53:43,440
books out there the two books recently

3163
01:53:47,270 --> 01:53:44,719
about palmer

3164
01:53:49,189 --> 01:53:47,280
and shaver and i know that we had

3165
01:53:51,990 --> 01:53:49,199
richard taranto

3166
01:53:54,470 --> 01:53:52,000
on the power cast a few years ago

3167
01:53:56,310 --> 01:53:54,480
where he was talking about the book and

3168
01:53:58,870 --> 01:53:56,320
if you look up richard toronto's name

3169
01:54:03,109 --> 01:53:58,880
when you do a search of the paracast

3170
01:54:06,790 --> 01:54:04,950
and you search toronto

3171
01:54:10,870 --> 01:54:06,800
you'll find out that richard toronto was

3172
01:54:13,910 --> 01:54:10,880
on july 7 2013 and the book was called

3173
01:54:16,390 --> 01:54:13,920
war over lemuria richard shaver ray

3174
01:54:18,870 --> 01:54:16,400
palmer and the strangest chapter of

3175
01:54:19,830 --> 01:54:18,880
1940s science fiction

3176
01:54:21,350 --> 01:54:19,840
okay

3177
01:54:23,750 --> 01:54:21,360
so that's where we kind of explained it

3178
01:54:25,750 --> 01:54:23,760
all it's very complicated there

3179
01:54:28,390 --> 01:54:25,760
and you know as a matter of fact

3180
01:54:29,830 --> 01:54:28,400
palmer was a very unusual person as i

3181
01:54:31,270 --> 01:54:29,840
said i knew him

3182
01:54:33,669 --> 01:54:31,280
and he made a lot of interesting

3183
01:54:37,430 --> 01:54:33,679
arguments one flying sausage here to

3184
01:54:39,030 --> 01:54:37,440
make us think he talked about ufos

3185
01:54:40,629 --> 01:54:39,040
in the inner earth and we're talking

3186
01:54:42,550 --> 01:54:40,639
about secret civilizations and we'll

3187
01:54:44,149 --> 01:54:42,560
focus more on that in a moment

3188
01:54:45,830 --> 01:54:44,159
that you can get to

3189
01:54:48,470 --> 01:54:45,840
through the whole

3190
01:54:51,910 --> 01:54:48,480
at the north and south poles but that in

3191
01:54:54,229 --> 01:54:51,920
also a sense is repeating the pellucidar

3192
01:54:56,470 --> 01:54:54,239
novels from edgar rice burrows of the

3193
01:54:58,709 --> 01:54:56,480
early part of the 20th century

3194
01:55:02,709 --> 01:54:58,719
okay that's how they did with a balloon

3195
01:55:04,470 --> 01:55:02,719
going or an airship or a dirigible going

3196
01:55:05,350 --> 01:55:04,480
through the whole to the center of the

3197
01:55:07,109 --> 01:55:05,360
earth

3198
01:55:07,990 --> 01:55:07,119
from this hole at the north and south

3199
01:55:10,470 --> 01:55:08,000
poles

3200
01:55:12,790 --> 01:55:10,480
then palmer suggested

3201
01:55:14,550 --> 01:55:12,800
they weren't physical holes they were in

3202
01:55:17,270 --> 01:55:14,560
the astral realm like you were going

3203
01:55:18,790 --> 01:55:17,280
into another reality a second reality to

3204
01:55:20,149 --> 01:55:18,800
go to the inner earth it wasn't

3205
01:55:21,350 --> 01:55:20,159
physically there

3206
01:55:23,669 --> 01:55:21,360
and then

3207
01:55:26,229 --> 01:55:23,679
i remember meeting for the first time a

3208
01:55:27,750 --> 01:55:26,239
very famous science fiction writer and a

3209
01:55:30,870 --> 01:55:27,760
comic book writer

3210
01:55:32,390 --> 01:55:30,880
otto bender do you remember who he was

3211
01:55:34,390 --> 01:55:32,400
you know the name

3212
01:55:36,790 --> 01:55:34,400
is extremely familiar you know uh no

3213
01:55:38,790 --> 01:55:36,800
relation to albert bender right no no

3214
01:55:41,990 --> 01:55:38,800
bender b-i-n-d-e-r

3215
01:55:44,310 --> 01:55:42,000
oh okay not bender okay otto bender in

3216
01:55:46,629 --> 01:55:44,320
the 1940s he worked on captain america

3217
01:55:48,550 --> 01:55:46,639
with stan lee

3218
01:55:50,790 --> 01:55:48,560
okay

3219
01:55:52,310 --> 01:55:50,800
all right he wrote the captain marvel

3220
01:55:55,109 --> 01:55:52,320
shazam stories

3221
01:55:57,109 --> 01:55:55,119
and in 1959 he was one of the creators

3222
01:55:58,709 --> 01:55:57,119
of supergirl

3223
01:56:01,589 --> 01:55:58,719
so i mentioned this to listeners before

3224
01:56:04,229 --> 01:56:01,599
when the supergirl tv show debuted

3225
01:56:05,990 --> 01:56:04,239
in the first episode supergirl

3226
01:56:08,229 --> 01:56:06,000
saves a plane

3227
01:56:09,189 --> 01:56:08,239
and causes some damage to a suspension

3228
01:56:14,709 --> 01:56:09,199
bridge

3229
01:56:16,709 --> 01:56:14,719
and for no other reason that otto bender

3230
01:56:19,109 --> 01:56:16,719
was one of the creators of supergirl

3231
01:56:20,550 --> 01:56:19,119
okay so i met otto bender knowing he was

3232
01:56:22,310 --> 01:56:20,560
a friend of ray palmer because he

3233
01:56:24,149 --> 01:56:22,320
founded a magazine called space world

3234
01:56:26,149 --> 01:56:24,159
that palmer took over

3235
01:56:27,189 --> 01:56:26,159
and i asked him about palmer what do you

3236
01:56:28,870 --> 01:56:27,199
think

3237
01:56:30,310 --> 01:56:28,880
and he said basically palmer would

3238
01:56:32,790 --> 01:56:30,320
simply

3239
01:56:33,910 --> 01:56:32,800
write crazy theories

3240
01:56:35,910 --> 01:56:33,920
just to get

3241
01:56:38,870 --> 01:56:35,920
readers to react and write letters to

3242
01:56:41,109 --> 01:56:38,880
the editor he did it at amazing stories

3243
01:56:42,790 --> 01:56:41,119
he did it for his own magazines flying

3244
01:56:45,109 --> 01:56:42,800
saucers in search

3245
01:56:46,149 --> 01:56:45,119
that this was just a way to start a

3246
01:56:48,310 --> 01:56:46,159
debate

3247
01:56:50,550 --> 01:56:48,320
he didn't necessarily believe it

3248
01:56:52,390 --> 01:56:50,560
so that's the theory about palmer

3249
01:56:53,669 --> 01:56:52,400
now that's actually really interesting

3250
01:56:55,750 --> 01:56:53,679
there was that

3251
01:56:57,350 --> 01:56:55,760
appearance that he did maybe one of a

3252
01:56:59,030 --> 01:56:57,360
few i don't know but i know that there's

3253
01:57:01,030 --> 01:56:59,040
one still available online in which he

3254
01:57:02,149 --> 01:57:01,040
appeared on the long john neville radio

3255
01:57:03,669 --> 01:57:02,159
program

3256
01:57:05,669 --> 01:57:03,679
in that and i may have mentioned this

3257
01:57:07,990 --> 01:57:05,679
before and i'm sure you're aware aware

3258
01:57:09,270 --> 01:57:08,000
of it as well gene but um for those out

3259
01:57:11,430 --> 01:57:09,280
there in listening land who have never

3260
01:57:13,270 --> 01:57:11,440
heard this palmer when he went on long

3261
01:57:15,189 --> 01:57:13,280
john neville's radio show was asked

3262
01:57:16,470 --> 01:57:15,199
about georgia damskin he said look i've

3263
01:57:18,470 --> 01:57:16,480
got to tell you

3264
01:57:20,790 --> 01:57:18,480
uh the book that became i guess uh it

3265
01:57:22,709 --> 01:57:20,800
was was it flying saucers have landed

3266
01:57:25,030 --> 01:57:22,719
right we'll give you the answer the

3267
01:57:27,030 --> 01:57:25,040
answer about ray palmer's appearance on

3268
01:57:28,709 --> 01:57:27,040
the long john ebbel radio show in our

3269
01:57:30,149 --> 01:57:28,719
next segment with micah hanks of the

3270
01:57:31,910 --> 01:57:30,159
ghrelian report

3271
01:57:37,030 --> 01:57:31,920
with jean and micah you're in the

3272
01:57:42,149 --> 01:57:39,430
if you're fascinated by ufos ancient

3273
01:57:44,470 --> 01:57:42,159
aliens archaeological mysteries ghost

3274
01:57:46,709 --> 01:57:44,480
hunting atlantis and any other

3275
01:57:49,830 --> 01:57:46,719
paranormal topic as we are be sure to

3276
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check out ap magazine.info each month

3277
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since 1985 it has presented the latest

3278
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research by top researchers like andrew

3279
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3280
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contains interviews with such leading

3281
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personalities as jacques fellais check

3282
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click on one of their banners and check

3283
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out ap apmagazine.info

3284
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3285
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pretty cheap but not all hosting is the

3286
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3287
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3288
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3289
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3290
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3292
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3293
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has to offer go to tech nightowl.com

3294
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3295
01:58:40,629 --> 01:58:38,960
when i was 15 and a half years of age i

3296
01:58:42,950 --> 01:58:40,639
had two large mercury fillings put into

3297
01:58:44,709 --> 01:58:42,960
my teeth i got very sick that day and

3298
01:58:46,950 --> 01:58:44,719
over time the mercury exposure damaged

3299
01:58:48,470 --> 01:58:46,960
my body my sunny disposition turned to

3300
01:58:50,149 --> 01:58:48,480
depression and low energy

3301
01:58:52,229 --> 01:58:50,159
many years later i understood what had

3302
01:58:54,390 --> 01:58:52,239
happened and in 1991 i replaced these

3303
01:58:56,550 --> 01:58:54,400
mercury fillings with white composite in

3304
01:58:58,629 --> 01:58:56,560
1997 i learned that the homeopathic

3305
01:59:00,550 --> 01:58:58,639
mercury detox i did years earlier did

3306
01:59:02,070 --> 01:59:00,560
not remove the mercury from my body i

3307
01:59:04,229 --> 01:59:02,080
began an effective means of removing

3308
01:59:05,830 --> 01:59:04,239
mercury from my body my digestion and

3309
01:59:08,310 --> 01:59:05,840
elimination returned to normal and i

3310
01:59:11,030 --> 01:59:08,320
began to have my life back from 1999 to

3311
01:59:13,270 --> 01:59:11,040
2005 i tested the level of mercury in my

3312
01:59:15,270 --> 01:59:13,280
body and each test showed my mercury

3313
01:59:17,430 --> 01:59:15,280
burden was high after five years on one

3314
01:59:19,270 --> 01:59:17,440
world way i recently did another mercury

3315
01:59:21,270 --> 01:59:19,280
test the results showed my body is free

3316
01:59:23,350 --> 01:59:21,280
of mercury and virtually all toxic

3317
01:59:25,350 --> 01:59:23,360
metals one world way is very powerful

3318
01:59:29,589 --> 01:59:25,360
for detoxification support it has helped

3319
01:59:34,300 --> 01:59:30,589
or 888-988-3325

3320
01:59:38,629 --> 01:59:34,310
oneworldway.com that's oneworld.whey.com

3321
01:59:40,790 --> 01:59:39,750
paid non-attorney spokesperson adam

3322
01:59:41,830 --> 01:59:40,800
polaski of the valencia law firm with

3323
01:59:42,790 --> 01:59:41,840
principal often used to texas is the

3324
01:59:43,830 --> 01:59:42,800
attorney responsible for the content of

3325
01:59:44,629 --> 01:59:43,840
this ad this ad is not legal advice and

3326
01:59:45,830 --> 01:59:44,639
the choice of a lawyer should not be

3327
01:59:47,030 --> 01:59:45,840
solely on advertisement services may not

3328
01:59:49,189 --> 01:59:47,040
be available in all states attention

3329
01:59:51,109 --> 01:59:49,199
zaroto users if you or a loved one took

3330
01:59:52,709 --> 01:59:51,119
xarelto and suffered a serious bleeding

3331
01:59:54,709 --> 01:59:52,719
event you may be entitled to financial

3332
01:59:55,990 --> 01:59:54,719
compensation xarelto is a popular

3333
01:59:57,589 --> 01:59:56,000
prescription blood thinner used to

3334
01:59:58,950 --> 01:59:57,599
prevent blood clots and protect patients

3335
02:00:00,390 --> 01:59:58,960
from strokes these serious bleeding

3336
02:00:02,149 --> 02:00:00,400
events have led to numerous cases of

3337
02:00:05,910 --> 02:00:02,159
hospitalization and even death phone

3338
02:00:09,910 --> 02:00:05,920
lines are open 24 7. call 800-261-0937

3339
02:00:13,990 --> 02:00:11,910
are you worried about your mom or dad

3340
02:00:16,550 --> 02:00:14,000
living alone in their house

3341
02:00:19,030 --> 02:00:16,560
hi i'm joan lunden listen i know how

3342
02:00:21,430 --> 02:00:19,040
difficult it is to find senior care for

3343
02:00:24,310 --> 02:00:21,440
someone you love that's why i recommend

3344
02:00:26,229 --> 02:00:24,320
a free service called a place for mom

3345
02:00:28,870 --> 02:00:26,239
they are the nation's largest senior

3346
02:00:30,149 --> 02:00:28,880
living referral service call a place for

3347
02:00:32,229 --> 02:00:30,159
mom today

3348
02:00:34,629 --> 02:00:32,239
to receive free information on senior

3349
02:00:40,149 --> 02:00:34,639
living communities in your area call a

3350
02:00:45,270 --> 02:00:42,790
a place for mom offers free one-on-one

3351
02:00:47,350 --> 02:00:45,280
advice from local advisors and a

3352
02:00:49,510 --> 02:00:47,360
personalized list of senior living

3353
02:00:51,830 --> 02:00:49,520
communities you can visit if you have

3354
02:00:54,229 --> 02:00:51,840
questions about senior care for your mom

3355
02:00:55,589 --> 02:00:54,239
or dad there's a place for answers a

3356
02:00:58,390 --> 02:00:55,599
place for mom

3357
02:01:00,229 --> 02:00:58,400
minutes to get your free ebook on

3358
02:01:02,070 --> 02:01:00,239
financing senior care as well as free

3359
02:01:04,350 --> 02:01:02,080
information on senior living communities

3360
02:01:08,950 --> 02:01:04,360
in your area call

3361
02:01:12,310 --> 02:01:10,470
this is dan pillow do you have the irs

3362
02:01:14,149 --> 02:01:12,320
money you can't pay are tax debts

3363
02:01:16,550 --> 02:01:14,159
crippling you i've defended people from

3364
02:01:18,629 --> 02:01:16,560
the irs for over 30 years i've helped

3365
02:01:19,990 --> 02:01:18,639
thousands and i can help you too i wrote

3366
02:01:21,750 --> 02:01:20,000
the book on irs settlement and i'm

3367
02:01:25,430 --> 02:01:21,760
telling you there's no such thing as a

3368
02:01:27,669 --> 02:01:25,440
hopeless case call 834 no tax to finally

3369
02:01:29,189 --> 02:01:27,679
get free of irs debt with the irs's new

3370
02:01:31,990 --> 02:01:29,199
programs there's never been a better

3371
02:01:35,830 --> 02:01:32,000
time to solve your problem call 834 no

3372
02:01:40,550 --> 02:01:35,840
tax that's 800 34 no tax or my website

3373
02:01:45,270 --> 02:01:42,790
we'd like to hear from you if you have a

3374
02:01:48,790 --> 02:01:45,280
comment or question about the paracast

3375
02:01:52,070 --> 02:01:48,800
send it to news at theparacast.com

3376
02:01:53,910 --> 02:01:52,080
that's news at theparacast.com

3377
02:01:56,390 --> 02:01:53,920
and don't forget to visit our famous

3378
02:01:59,200 --> 02:01:56,400
paracast community forums at

3379
02:02:00,629 --> 02:01:59,210
forum.theparacast.com

3380
02:02:03,270 --> 02:02:00,639
[Music]

3381
02:02:04,709 --> 02:02:03,280
so let's talk about that background ray

3382
02:02:06,870 --> 02:02:04,719
palmer is a guest

3383
02:02:08,870 --> 02:02:06,880
on long john ebbel long john neville

3384
02:02:12,470 --> 02:02:08,880
being the famous talk show host of the

3385
02:02:14,390 --> 02:02:12,480
50s 60s and 70s who pioneered all night

3386
02:02:17,430 --> 02:02:14,400
paranormal radio before there was ever a

3387
02:02:19,990 --> 02:02:17,440
coast to coast am with art bell long

3388
02:02:21,910 --> 02:02:20,000
john did it first okay

3389
02:02:24,310 --> 02:02:21,920
now palmer is interviewed by phone from

3390
02:02:27,109 --> 02:02:24,320
his home in amherst wisconsin and he

3391
02:02:28,950 --> 02:02:27,119
mentions with regard to george adamski

3392
02:02:29,990 --> 02:02:28,960
who wrote the book flying sausage have

3393
02:02:31,910 --> 02:02:30,000
landed

3394
02:02:34,390 --> 02:02:31,920
about something else that dempsey did

3395
02:02:36,149 --> 02:02:34,400
some years earlier tell us more micah

3396
02:02:38,629 --> 02:02:36,159
yeah uh when ray palmer had been working

3397
02:02:40,629 --> 02:02:38,639
for amazing stories i believe is when he

3398
02:02:43,589 --> 02:02:40,639
first received a manuscript in which uh

3399
02:02:46,229 --> 02:02:43,599
there was a spacecraft piloted by i

3400
02:02:47,030 --> 02:02:46,239
believe jesus christ came to earth and

3401
02:02:49,910 --> 02:02:47,040
was

3402
02:02:51,589 --> 02:02:49,920
of the sort of contact t literature that

3403
02:02:53,189 --> 02:02:51,599
would appear years later

3404
02:02:56,229 --> 02:02:53,199
the author of this manuscript had been

3405
02:02:58,629 --> 02:02:56,239
none other than one uh george adamski

3406
02:03:01,430 --> 02:02:58,639
ray palmer again who apparently a person

3407
02:03:03,910 --> 02:03:01,440
who through if not his actual beliefs or

3408
02:03:05,830 --> 02:03:03,920
theories nonetheless for interesting and

3409
02:03:07,750 --> 02:03:05,840
spirited debate would put out these

3410
02:03:09,270 --> 02:03:07,760
unique theories about what ufos may be

3411
02:03:11,350 --> 02:03:09,280
and whether they were crypto terrestrial

3412
02:03:13,350 --> 02:03:11,360
civilizations which was kind of

3413
02:03:14,709 --> 02:03:13,360
i guess in that era palmer was kind of

3414
02:03:17,910 --> 02:03:14,719
one of the leading proponents of this

3415
02:03:20,390 --> 02:03:17,920
idea uh in a moment of noted skepticism

3416
02:03:21,589 --> 02:03:20,400
for palmer on neville's radio program he

3417
02:03:24,390 --> 02:03:21,599
said i've got to tell you though the

3418
02:03:26,070 --> 02:03:24,400
same story was repackaged by damski a

3419
02:03:27,910 --> 02:03:26,080
few years later flying saucers have

3420
02:03:29,910 --> 02:03:27,920
landed was that was co-authored with

3421
02:03:31,589 --> 02:03:29,920
desmond leslie he said that in the new

3422
02:03:33,189 --> 02:03:31,599
book of course it wasn't jesus in a

3423
02:03:36,470 --> 02:03:33,199
spaceship it was a flying saucer and

3424
02:03:38,149 --> 02:03:36,480
orthon was the occupant so palmer was

3425
02:03:39,910 --> 02:03:38,159
convinced that the damski was just an

3426
02:03:42,790 --> 02:03:39,920
out and out liar who changed his stories

3427
02:03:44,629 --> 02:03:42,800
to try and match the popular belief

3428
02:03:46,310 --> 02:03:44,639
associated with ufos that would soon

3429
02:03:47,669 --> 02:03:46,320
follow kenneth arnold's encounter with

3430
02:03:48,709 --> 02:03:47,679
alleged flying saucers over mount

3431
02:03:50,870 --> 02:03:48,719
rainier

3432
02:03:52,790 --> 02:03:50,880
now edward rupelt

3433
02:03:55,109 --> 02:03:52,800
thought adamski was an out and out con

3434
02:03:57,910 --> 02:03:55,119
man but you know there's still a george

3435
02:04:00,149 --> 02:03:57,920
adamski foundation out there and i heard

3436
02:04:01,830 --> 02:04:00,159
from someone who represented that place

3437
02:04:04,070 --> 02:04:01,840
and they wanted me to interview i guess

3438
02:04:06,310 --> 02:04:04,080
one of the big muckety mucks at this

3439
02:04:08,870 --> 02:04:06,320
organization so i said you know what

3440
02:04:12,310 --> 02:04:08,880
aren't you aware that adamski was

3441
02:04:14,870 --> 02:04:12,320
exposed many many years ago and i

3442
02:04:17,189 --> 02:04:14,880
mentioned as one example jim mosley has

3443
02:04:19,430 --> 02:04:17,199
special edition of the saucer news

3444
02:04:22,070 --> 02:04:19,440
magazine where you have the adamski

3445
02:04:24,390 --> 02:04:22,080
expose issue but to add to that that's

3446
02:04:26,790 --> 02:04:24,400
been reprinted by the way we do have it

3447
02:04:29,669 --> 02:04:26,800
online at jimmosley.com that's a site

3448
02:04:31,990 --> 02:04:29,679
that i run off my server and kurt

3449
02:04:35,109 --> 02:04:32,000
collins a fairly regular guest on the

3450
02:04:37,990 --> 02:04:35,119
show manages now the other thing here is

3451
02:04:41,270 --> 02:04:38,000
that adamski had also said quoted in

3452
02:04:42,870 --> 02:04:41,280
this adamski expose issue that sometimes

3453
02:04:45,830 --> 02:04:42,880
you have to go through the back store to

3454
02:04:48,149 --> 02:04:45,840
get the truth across so in writing this

3455
02:04:49,910 --> 02:04:48,159
manuscript where he met jesus christ in

3456
02:04:51,750 --> 02:04:49,920
a spaceship he was spreading a message

3457
02:04:52,870 --> 02:04:51,760
of peace and brotherhood and then in

3458
02:04:55,030 --> 02:04:52,880
order to

3459
02:04:57,750 --> 02:04:55,040
deal with the cultural meme about ufos

3460
02:05:01,189 --> 02:04:57,760
in the early 50s he had that

3461
02:05:02,870 --> 02:05:01,199
same message expressed by orthon the

3462
02:05:05,910 --> 02:05:02,880
silver suited

3463
02:05:07,910 --> 02:05:05,920
et he met now by the way michael rennie

3464
02:05:09,669 --> 02:05:07,920
in the movie dave the earth stood still

3465
02:05:11,830 --> 02:05:09,679
wore a silvery suit but he didn't have

3466
02:05:13,990 --> 02:05:11,840
long hair he had normal length hair but

3467
02:05:16,550 --> 02:05:14,000
you can see where dave earth stood still

3468
02:05:18,070 --> 02:05:16,560
influenced the early contactees too yeah

3469
02:05:20,709 --> 02:05:18,080
you know what is kind of funny gene is

3470
02:05:22,709 --> 02:05:20,719
that with those early contact d cases

3471
02:05:24,390 --> 02:05:22,719
you see a thread which i know joseph

3472
02:05:27,270 --> 02:05:24,400
farrell and a few others have talked

3473
02:05:29,830 --> 02:05:27,280
about which is the fact that many of the

3474
02:05:31,589 --> 02:05:29,840
reported contactees reported that the

3475
02:05:33,350 --> 02:05:31,599
entities that they encountered were

3476
02:05:35,270 --> 02:05:33,360
first of all very human-like they

3477
02:05:36,790 --> 02:05:35,280
weren't exotic-looking alien creatures

3478
02:05:39,270 --> 02:05:36,800
and second of all many of them in

3479
02:05:41,669 --> 02:05:39,280
addition to having uh telepathic powers

3480
02:05:43,109 --> 02:05:41,679
were often blonde hair and blue eyed the

3481
02:05:45,189 --> 02:05:43,119
epitome of their gender to borrow the

3482
02:05:47,189 --> 02:05:45,199
terminology that later would be used by

3483
02:05:49,109 --> 02:05:47,199
travis walton during his uh abduction

3484
02:05:51,750 --> 02:05:49,119
experience because he described very

3485
02:05:53,910 --> 02:05:51,760
similar beings we find in the famous

3486
02:05:56,310 --> 02:05:53,920
friendship island case from off the

3487
02:05:58,229 --> 02:05:56,320
coast of chile island in the 1980s off

3488
02:05:59,990 --> 02:05:58,239
the southern coast of chile and again

3489
02:06:02,229 --> 02:06:00,000
this is well-known perhaps one of the

3490
02:06:04,149 --> 02:06:02,239
most well-known ufo cases in latin

3491
02:06:06,470 --> 02:06:04,159
america of the last few decades and

3492
02:06:09,109 --> 02:06:06,480
strangely in i think north america and

3493
02:06:10,709 --> 02:06:09,119
parts of europe it's very less

3494
02:06:12,470 --> 02:06:10,719
well-known i've sat down with many

3495
02:06:13,669 --> 02:06:12,480
extremely knowledgeable ufo researchers

3496
02:06:15,109 --> 02:06:13,679
when i bring up friendship island they

3497
02:06:18,310 --> 02:06:15,119
say you mean the italian case from the

3498
02:06:20,390 --> 02:06:18,320
1950s well this was used a similar name

3499
02:06:22,390 --> 02:06:20,400
for this case from the 80s but what had

3500
02:06:24,470 --> 02:06:22,400
been described during a lot of these

3501
02:06:26,390 --> 02:06:24,480
purported contacts with the denizens of

3502
02:06:28,149 --> 02:06:26,400
the friendship island which very long

3503
02:06:29,350 --> 02:06:28,159
story short it was believed to be some

3504
02:06:31,030 --> 02:06:29,360
sort of an island with some sort of an

3505
02:06:33,030 --> 02:06:31,040
operation theories about it range from

3506
02:06:35,270 --> 02:06:33,040
being an alien base on earth to being

3507
02:06:37,990 --> 02:06:35,280
some sort of an area 51 kind of

3508
02:06:39,750 --> 02:06:38,000
operation uh one theory holds that it

3509
02:06:42,550 --> 02:06:39,760
was a joint cooperative kind of effort

3510
02:06:44,310 --> 02:06:42,560
between germans post world war ii nazis

3511
02:06:45,189 --> 02:06:44,320
maybe that escaped and also the u.s air

3512
02:06:46,870 --> 02:06:45,199
force

3513
02:06:48,709 --> 02:06:46,880
any number of different interpretations

3514
02:06:50,550 --> 02:06:48,719
of what might have been going on out

3515
02:06:51,910 --> 02:06:50,560
there but ernesto de la fuente i think

3516
02:06:53,510 --> 02:06:51,920
was the first guy who claimed to have

3517
02:06:55,350 --> 02:06:53,520
had these encounters with the holy

3518
02:06:57,189 --> 02:06:55,360
brothers of friendship island again tall

3519
02:06:58,870 --> 02:06:57,199
blonde haired guys blue eyes and that

3520
02:07:00,870 --> 02:06:58,880
they all look so similar could just

3521
02:07:02,310 --> 02:07:00,880
literally be brothers so it's just kind

3522
02:07:03,830 --> 02:07:02,320
of interesting that throughout the years

3523
02:07:05,430 --> 02:07:03,840
it wasn't just zamsky but there have

3524
02:07:07,910 --> 02:07:05,440
been many who have described having

3525
02:07:10,629 --> 02:07:07,920
these encounters with these almost

3526
02:07:12,870 --> 02:07:10,639
angelic like human type creatures which

3527
02:07:14,470 --> 02:07:12,880
claim to be aliens variously those from

3528
02:07:15,830 --> 02:07:14,480
friendship island made similar claims

3529
02:07:18,470 --> 02:07:15,840
that they were either angels of the lord

3530
02:07:20,149 --> 02:07:18,480
or actually from outer space themselves

3531
02:07:22,790 --> 02:07:20,159
well i don't want to get into the racial

3532
02:07:24,550 --> 02:07:22,800
aspect but they tend to be white nordic

3533
02:07:26,870 --> 02:07:24,560
types

3534
02:07:29,189 --> 02:07:26,880
they're not hispanics they're not black

3535
02:07:31,030 --> 02:07:29,199
they're not asian just saying yeah and

3536
02:07:32,229 --> 02:07:31,040
that is important you know like you said

3537
02:07:34,149 --> 02:07:32,239
without having to really go down that

3538
02:07:35,589 --> 02:07:34,159
rabbit hole because unfortunately

3539
02:07:38,790 --> 02:07:35,599
interpretations

3540
02:07:40,470 --> 02:07:38,800
of the apparent presence of of these

3541
02:07:42,470 --> 02:07:40,480
or the consistency of the interpretation

3542
02:07:44,229 --> 02:07:42,480
of these so-called nordic aliens i think

3543
02:07:47,189 --> 02:07:44,239
it has been a point that some have used

3544
02:07:49,350 --> 02:07:47,199
as leverage against fringe movements ufo

3545
02:07:51,109 --> 02:07:49,360
advocates and researchers in this field

3546
02:07:52,950 --> 02:07:51,119
by various individuals from more skeptic

3547
02:07:55,189 --> 02:07:52,960
circles which is unfortunate because at

3548
02:07:56,629 --> 02:07:55,199
some point along the way skeptics rather

3549
02:07:57,910 --> 02:07:56,639
than saying let's make a good argument

3550
02:08:00,229 --> 02:07:57,920
against something let's

3551
02:08:01,669 --> 02:08:00,239
instead they tend to employ character

3552
02:08:03,189 --> 02:08:01,679
assassination we've talked about this in

3553
02:08:04,870 --> 02:08:03,199
the past when i've come on and discussed

3554
02:08:06,550 --> 02:08:04,880
frederick valentich character

3555
02:08:08,870 --> 02:08:06,560
assassination and ways to diminish an

3556
02:08:11,350 --> 02:08:08,880
argument by pointing out the if not

3557
02:08:13,830 --> 02:08:11,360
fallacies the apparent sometimes tenuous

3558
02:08:15,990 --> 02:08:13,840
connections to negativity and anything

3559
02:08:17,669 --> 02:08:16,000
from race issues to people smuggling

3560
02:08:19,750 --> 02:08:17,679
drugs like class had said about

3561
02:08:21,589 --> 02:08:19,760
valentich you know these kinds of

3562
02:08:22,790 --> 02:08:21,599
elements are presented for purpose of

3563
02:08:23,990 --> 02:08:22,800
diminishing the argument through

3564
02:08:25,109 --> 02:08:24,000
character assassination and

3565
02:08:26,790 --> 02:08:25,119
unfortunately we've seen a little of

3566
02:08:28,310 --> 02:08:26,800
that with the apparent trends that

3567
02:08:30,470 --> 02:08:28,320
emerge in the contact you literature

3568
02:08:32,470 --> 02:08:30,480
just as well now what do you see in the

3569
02:08:35,830 --> 02:08:32,480
contact literature that you're referring

3570
02:08:37,270 --> 02:08:35,840
to just the nordic type alien or what

3571
02:08:39,350 --> 02:08:37,280
yeah i mean the point i'm making here is

3572
02:08:41,510 --> 02:08:39,360
that again the apparent presence of a

3573
02:08:43,589 --> 02:08:41,520
nordic alien you know with blonde hair

3574
02:08:45,830 --> 02:08:43,599
and the blue eyes this isn't the only

3575
02:08:48,709 --> 02:08:45,840
consistency but i mean this idea of this

3576
02:08:50,550 --> 02:08:48,719
kind of a anglo this perfect kind of uh

3577
02:08:52,149 --> 02:08:50,560
well i'll tell you you know for instance

3578
02:08:53,669 --> 02:08:52,159
during the second world war this would

3579
02:08:55,830 --> 02:08:53,679
have been what hitler and the nazis

3580
02:08:57,830 --> 02:08:55,840
would have probably called an ideal

3581
02:08:59,750 --> 02:08:57,840
looking person we of course today

3582
02:09:02,149 --> 02:08:59,760
recognize the the obvious problems with

3583
02:09:04,069 --> 02:09:02,159
that the unfortunate ideology of the

3584
02:09:05,990 --> 02:09:04,079
nazis that believed these kinds of

3585
02:09:08,550 --> 02:09:06,000
things joseph farrell as a researcher

3586
02:09:10,069 --> 02:09:08,560
has really pointed this out this is one

3587
02:09:13,109 --> 02:09:10,079
element that emerges but there are

3588
02:09:16,390 --> 02:09:13,119
others too which kind of tie in with the

3589
02:09:17,830 --> 02:09:16,400
nazi ufo conspiracy theories i don't

3590
02:09:19,350 --> 02:09:17,840
mean to use that term as i will often

3591
02:09:20,470 --> 02:09:19,360
say here's your trigger warning people

3592
02:09:22,629 --> 02:09:20,480
you know that i don't mean to use

3593
02:09:24,069 --> 02:09:22,639
conspiracy theory as the weaponized term

3594
02:09:26,229 --> 02:09:24,079
that i think many in the mainstream

3595
02:09:28,550 --> 02:09:26,239
media use it for i've been referred to

3596
02:09:31,430 --> 02:09:28,560
as a conspiracy theorist or a conspiracy

3597
02:09:33,109 --> 02:09:31,440
theory author because i write about ufos

3598
02:09:35,030 --> 02:09:33,119
no matter how scientific you try to be

3599
02:09:37,589 --> 02:09:35,040
about this there is this kind of a

3600
02:09:39,430 --> 02:09:37,599
collective attitude among many people

3601
02:09:40,790 --> 02:09:39,440
today that this is a silly topic and

3602
02:09:43,189 --> 02:09:40,800
that anyone who discusses it is a

3603
02:09:45,669 --> 02:09:43,199
conspiracy theorist who believes in ufos

3604
02:09:48,149 --> 02:09:45,679
but within serious ufo study there are a

3605
02:09:49,669 --> 02:09:48,159
number of theories that tie everything

3606
02:09:51,669 --> 02:09:49,679
from the nazis into and this is well

3607
02:09:53,109 --> 02:09:51,679
known so joseph farrell the book

3608
02:09:54,950 --> 02:09:53,119
specifically although it's actually been

3609
02:09:57,910 --> 02:09:54,960
i should say in a few of his books but

3610
02:09:59,990 --> 02:09:57,920
saucers swastikas and psyops was the

3611
02:10:02,470 --> 02:10:00,000
book in particular that looked at some

3612
02:10:04,470 --> 02:10:02,480
of these early contact t stories the

3613
02:10:06,629 --> 02:10:04,480
themes and the imagery present in them

3614
02:10:09,030 --> 02:10:06,639
their relationship with again fascist

3615
02:10:11,830 --> 02:10:09,040
movements like the nazi ideology which

3616
02:10:13,910 --> 02:10:11,840
was as the researcher peter lavendable

3617
02:10:16,310 --> 02:10:13,920
point out it was very much a kind of an

3618
02:10:18,790 --> 02:10:16,320
occult movement as much as it was any

3619
02:10:21,030 --> 02:10:18,800
kind of a political movement

3620
02:10:29,510 --> 02:10:21,040
we've got more to come with gene and

3621
02:10:34,350 --> 02:10:33,030
thank you for listening to gcn

3622
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3623
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3691
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3692
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3708
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3709
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3715
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[Music]

3718
02:14:58,790 --> 02:14:48,639
hi my name is richard dolan you're

3719
02:15:02,950 --> 02:15:01,270
we continue two more segments left with

3720
02:15:05,510 --> 02:15:02,960
micah hanks and we're starting to get

3721
02:15:06,629 --> 02:15:05,520
into the rabbit hole of secret societies

3722
02:15:08,790 --> 02:15:06,639
and stuff

3723
02:15:11,109 --> 02:15:08,800
so i want to continue in that vein with

3724
02:15:12,709 --> 02:15:11,119
micah hanks of the grealian report micah

3725
02:15:14,069 --> 02:15:12,719
yeah certainly well a good way to bridge

3726
02:15:15,510 --> 02:15:14,079
over i guess from what we were talking

3727
02:15:17,990 --> 02:15:15,520
about in the last segment is the

3728
02:15:19,589 --> 02:15:18,000
so-called conspiracy theories that tie

3729
02:15:21,750 --> 02:15:19,599
in everything from possible nazi

3730
02:15:24,550 --> 02:15:21,760
technology and things like this with the

3731
02:15:27,189 --> 02:15:24,560
idea of modern ufos and i think that uh

3732
02:15:29,189 --> 02:15:27,199
maybe william cooper had been one

3733
02:15:30,870 --> 02:15:29,199
who uh initially he's an interesting

3734
02:15:32,550 --> 02:15:30,880
character any way you want to look at it

3735
02:15:35,270 --> 02:15:32,560
controversial too

3736
02:15:37,109 --> 02:15:35,280
when cooper became involved in in the

3737
02:15:39,430 --> 02:15:37,119
ufo community he was first saying that

3738
02:15:41,350 --> 02:15:39,440
he had been given information or that he

3739
02:15:43,189 --> 02:15:41,360
had obtained information and been shown

3740
02:15:44,229 --> 02:15:43,199
this during his time as a naval officer

3741
02:15:47,430 --> 02:15:44,239
and of course that this seemed to

3742
02:15:49,109 --> 02:15:47,440
substantiate mj-12 and then he later on

3743
02:15:50,470 --> 02:15:49,119
kind of didn't about face and cooper is

3744
02:15:52,229 --> 02:15:50,480
he became more and more involved and i

3745
02:15:53,830 --> 02:15:52,239
think the real the kind of right wing

3746
02:15:55,990 --> 02:15:53,840
constitutionalist

3747
02:15:57,669 --> 02:15:56,000
movements that uh were particularly

3748
02:15:59,750 --> 02:15:57,679
active in the 1990s and began to be

3749
02:16:01,589 --> 02:15:59,760
around that time he began to kind of

3750
02:16:03,109 --> 02:16:01,599
change his perspectives and cooper had

3751
02:16:04,149 --> 02:16:03,119
gone on to say he didn't think that they

3752
02:16:05,270 --> 02:16:04,159
were anything that he thought they were

3753
02:16:07,430 --> 02:16:05,280
he said he thought that they were our

3754
02:16:09,030 --> 02:16:07,440
own he thought that he had been lied to

3755
02:16:10,310 --> 02:16:09,040
and had been misled to believe that

3756
02:16:12,470 --> 02:16:10,320
aliens were visiting earth and he

3757
02:16:13,990 --> 02:16:12,480
thought that the truth was that whatever

3758
02:16:15,189 --> 02:16:14,000
this technology was it was something our

3759
02:16:17,030 --> 02:16:15,199
own government was using and that there

3760
02:16:19,270 --> 02:16:17,040
was a massive disinformation campaign

3761
02:16:20,390 --> 02:16:19,280
that he had actually fallen victim to

3762
02:16:22,550 --> 02:16:20,400
himself

3763
02:16:24,550 --> 02:16:22,560
which brings us to this

3764
02:16:27,109 --> 02:16:24,560
notion gene that uh you know and some

3765
02:16:30,310 --> 02:16:27,119
have as cooper did suggested that maybe

3766
02:16:31,430 --> 02:16:30,320
the the mystery of the ufo presence can

3767
02:16:33,190 --> 02:16:31,440
be explained through earthly

3768
02:16:35,750 --> 02:16:33,200
technologies and if not aliens and if

3769
02:16:38,150 --> 02:16:35,760
not some crypto-terrestrial civilization

3770
02:16:39,030 --> 02:16:38,160
then could it be our own global elitists

3771
02:16:40,870 --> 02:16:39,040
our own

3772
02:16:43,349 --> 02:16:40,880
puppeteers that are pulling the strings

3773
02:16:45,349 --> 02:16:43,359
from behind the scenes and controlling

3774
02:16:48,150 --> 02:16:45,359
world affairs i would say as far as

3775
02:16:50,870 --> 02:16:48,160
conspiracy theories go uh you know that

3776
02:16:52,709 --> 02:16:50,880
may be just as valid a theory to support

3777
02:16:55,030 --> 02:16:52,719
the idea of ufos as any that we've

3778
02:16:57,030 --> 02:16:55,040
examined here you know et or whatever

3779
02:16:59,429 --> 02:16:57,040
else and so i guess one might question

3780
02:17:01,110 --> 02:16:59,439
could secret societies in some way shape

3781
02:17:02,070 --> 02:17:01,120
or form have anything to do with ufos i

3782
02:17:04,230 --> 02:17:02,080
guess that would be the fundamental

3783
02:17:07,349 --> 02:17:04,240
premise huh well let's look at secret

3784
02:17:09,669 --> 02:17:07,359
societies now we have richard dolan who

3785
02:17:10,629 --> 02:17:09,679
talks of breakaway civilizations which

3786
02:17:12,389 --> 02:17:10,639
implies

3787
02:17:14,389 --> 02:17:12,399
that a group of people for whatever

3788
02:17:17,509 --> 02:17:14,399
reason decide they don't want to be a

3789
02:17:18,309 --> 02:17:17,519
part of our society they'll invent their

3790
02:17:20,150 --> 02:17:18,319
own

3791
02:17:22,950 --> 02:17:20,160
and go somewhere where they're not apt

3792
02:17:24,870 --> 02:17:22,960
to be seen or discovered right i've been

3793
02:17:26,549 --> 02:17:24,880
fascinated with that theory for quite

3794
02:17:29,270 --> 02:17:26,559
some time and what's funny is i was in

3795
02:17:31,910 --> 02:17:29,280
uh i was in leeds england with richard

3796
02:17:33,830 --> 02:17:31,920
last october and he and i went walking

3797
02:17:35,349 --> 02:17:33,840
all over town one evening and we found

3798
02:17:37,190 --> 02:17:35,359
this uh we were trying to find a

3799
02:17:38,549 --> 02:17:37,200
restaurant he and anthony beckett and i

3800
02:17:40,309 --> 02:17:38,559
and i think mike clelland and his

3801
02:17:41,750 --> 02:17:40,319
girlfriend were with us as we were

3802
02:17:43,429 --> 02:17:41,760
stomping around leads trying to find a

3803
02:17:45,110 --> 02:17:43,439
restaurant we found this great indian

3804
02:17:46,469 --> 02:17:45,120
spot and so we go in there and rich and

3805
02:17:48,469 --> 02:17:46,479
i are sitting side by side and we were

3806
02:17:50,389 --> 02:17:48,479
talking and again i'd like to point out

3807
02:17:52,790 --> 02:17:50,399
here that the idea of in its modern

3808
02:17:54,709 --> 02:17:52,800
usage a breakaway civilization was first

3809
02:17:56,629 --> 02:17:54,719
to my knowledge employed by richard

3810
02:17:57,830 --> 02:17:56,639
dolan and i've subsequently heard that

3811
02:18:00,309 --> 02:17:57,840
term used by a number of other

3812
02:18:02,309 --> 02:18:00,319
researchers most recently to my shock

3813
02:18:04,709 --> 02:18:02,319
and amazement i even heard alex jones

3814
02:18:06,870 --> 02:18:04,719
refer to the breakaway civilization so a

3815
02:18:08,709 --> 02:18:06,880
lot of people have applied that

3816
02:18:10,870 --> 02:18:08,719
terminology and really i think we have

3817
02:18:12,549 --> 02:18:10,880
rich to credit for that concept now that

3818
02:18:14,790 --> 02:18:12,559
said when i was having dinner with

3819
02:18:16,230 --> 02:18:14,800
richard in leeds and the food was very

3820
02:18:18,230 --> 02:18:16,240
good i might add

3821
02:18:20,309 --> 02:18:18,240
i was amazed that when i brought the

3822
02:18:21,910 --> 02:18:20,319
friendship island case from chile in the

3823
02:18:24,469 --> 02:18:21,920
1980s to his attention he wasn't

3824
02:18:25,910 --> 02:18:24,479
familiar with that one which i think is

3825
02:18:27,990 --> 02:18:25,920
if the stories are to be believed i

3826
02:18:30,549 --> 02:18:28,000
should say maybe one of the best

3827
02:18:31,910 --> 02:18:30,559
particular um ufo cases that comes to

3828
02:18:34,070 --> 02:18:31,920
mind whether or not it's really related

3829
02:18:35,509 --> 02:18:34,080
to ufos i would i would question but it

3830
02:18:37,750 --> 02:18:35,519
certainly does seem to suggest some

3831
02:18:39,990 --> 02:18:37,760
group or some sort of an operation

3832
02:18:41,349 --> 02:18:40,000
carried out by those on the periphery of

3833
02:18:42,950 --> 02:18:41,359
humankind that really don't want

3834
02:18:43,990 --> 02:18:42,960
anything to do with the typical global

3835
02:18:45,990 --> 02:18:44,000
affairs

3836
02:18:47,270 --> 02:18:46,000
as we know it in terms of geopolitics

3837
02:18:48,870 --> 02:18:47,280
now when it comes to the idea of secret

3838
02:18:51,030 --> 02:18:48,880
societies and how they may relate to

3839
02:18:52,629 --> 02:18:51,040
that again the fundamental premise and

3840
02:18:54,709 --> 02:18:52,639
this is once again i guess say an

3841
02:18:57,190 --> 02:18:54,719
extrapolation on conspiracy theories as

3842
02:18:59,830 --> 02:18:57,200
it relates to ufo studies over the years

3843
02:19:01,589 --> 02:18:59,840
the premise is that globalist groups and

3844
02:19:02,950 --> 02:19:01,599
i keep using that term globalist there

3845
02:19:04,790 --> 02:19:02,960
are certain terms that i mean they're

3846
02:19:07,110 --> 02:19:04,800
common in conspiracy literature

3847
02:19:09,190 --> 02:19:07,120
globalization or globalists who are

3848
02:19:11,110 --> 02:19:09,200
those who advocate it new world order

3849
02:19:12,549 --> 02:19:11,120
this is a term that was utilized by

3850
02:19:15,190 --> 02:19:12,559
george herbert walker bush during his

3851
02:19:17,429 --> 02:19:15,200
presidency and others have used it also

3852
02:19:20,150 --> 02:19:17,439
what we're talking about is an expanded

3853
02:19:22,389 --> 02:19:20,160
effort by those in power and control

3854
02:19:23,990 --> 02:19:22,399
particularly in north america and europe

3855
02:19:26,469 --> 02:19:24,000
to foster not only goodwill but

3856
02:19:27,990 --> 02:19:26,479
furthered cooperation and working

3857
02:19:28,870 --> 02:19:28,000
between north america and parts of

3858
02:19:31,190 --> 02:19:28,880
europe

3859
02:19:33,030 --> 02:19:31,200
in an effort to globalize

3860
02:19:35,270 --> 02:19:33,040
a sort of world economy and political

3861
02:19:37,429 --> 02:19:35,280
structure this is a you know a rough

3862
02:19:39,429 --> 02:19:37,439
explanation for this idea of globalism

3863
02:19:41,270 --> 02:19:39,439
not some of the downside of globalism is

3864
02:19:43,669 --> 02:19:41,280
as was described in time magazine

3865
02:19:46,230 --> 02:19:43,679
recently stuff like the panama papers

3866
02:19:48,070 --> 02:19:46,240
most like fonseca globalization has also

3867
02:19:49,429 --> 02:19:48,080
made it more easy for those in power and

3868
02:19:51,110 --> 02:19:49,439
who you know

3869
02:19:52,469 --> 02:19:51,120
maintain one the top one percent you

3870
02:19:54,230 --> 02:19:52,479
know of all the wealth in the world the

3871
02:19:55,990 --> 02:19:54,240
one percenters as they're called it's

3872
02:19:58,309 --> 02:19:56,000
made it easy for them to be able to you

3873
02:20:01,030 --> 02:19:58,319
know move their funds around and also

3874
02:20:02,469 --> 02:20:01,040
evade taxation with it so there are

3875
02:20:04,790 --> 02:20:02,479
problems obviously associated with

3876
02:20:07,349 --> 02:20:04,800
globalism and many conspiracy i guess

3877
02:20:09,110 --> 02:20:07,359
presenters or commentators often argue

3878
02:20:10,710 --> 02:20:09,120
against globalization but one thing that

3879
02:20:13,110 --> 02:20:10,720
we might further

3880
02:20:14,950 --> 02:20:13,120
infer based on the literature is that

3881
02:20:17,429 --> 02:20:14,960
those in power and in positions of

3882
02:20:19,429 --> 02:20:17,439
wealth and those capable of moving funds

3883
02:20:21,510 --> 02:20:19,439
around into secret locations keeping

3884
02:20:23,429 --> 02:20:21,520
them off the record could easily

3885
02:20:25,510 --> 02:20:23,439
influence and even possibly bankroll

3886
02:20:28,070 --> 02:20:25,520
private funded projects that would

3887
02:20:29,349 --> 02:20:28,080
utilize highly advanced technologies and

3888
02:20:31,750 --> 02:20:29,359
that brings us to the breakaway

3889
02:20:32,630 --> 02:20:31,760
civilization richard has suggested that

3890
02:20:34,550 --> 02:20:32,640
uh

3891
02:20:36,790 --> 02:20:34,560
perhaps one interpretation of the ufo

3892
02:20:39,349 --> 02:20:36,800
phenomena is that the workings of such

3893
02:20:41,270 --> 02:20:39,359
groups with their financial assets with

3894
02:20:43,270 --> 02:20:41,280
their shadowy dealings in the world of

3895
02:20:44,790 --> 02:20:43,280
banking and their ability to be able to

3896
02:20:45,990 --> 02:20:44,800
privately and quietly fund such

3897
02:20:48,389 --> 02:20:46,000
operations that that might be the

3898
02:20:50,469 --> 02:20:48,399
reality behind the ufo phenomena

3899
02:20:51,510 --> 02:20:50,479
which is extremely interesting to me and

3900
02:20:53,110 --> 02:20:51,520
although a lot of people say that

3901
02:20:55,750 --> 02:20:53,120
there's nothing to it and it couldn't be

3902
02:20:58,550 --> 02:20:55,760
the case i ask you simply this

3903
02:21:00,150 --> 02:20:58,560
is it any crazier than the idea that e.t

3904
02:21:02,469 --> 02:21:00,160
is visiting earth if we're to presume

3905
02:21:04,550 --> 02:21:02,479
that there's anything to ufos at all

3906
02:21:05,670 --> 02:21:04,560
are we crazy to say that well this could

3907
02:21:07,270 --> 02:21:05,680
be something that could be explained

3908
02:21:10,110 --> 02:21:07,280
through earthly technologies behind the

3909
02:21:12,230 --> 02:21:10,120
scenes rather than ets interdimensionals

3910
02:21:14,150 --> 02:21:12,240
crypto-terrestrials something like that

3911
02:21:17,270 --> 02:21:14,160
it seems like in fact of those

3912
02:21:18,469 --> 02:21:17,280
possibilities the least crazy perhaps of

3913
02:21:20,550 --> 02:21:18,479
them all

3914
02:21:23,110 --> 02:21:20,560
of course we can theorize all the time

3915
02:21:25,830 --> 02:21:23,120
about a breakaway civilization about a

3916
02:21:28,150 --> 02:21:25,840
secret organization that manages things

3917
02:21:30,710 --> 02:21:28,160
such as the builder burgers or the

3918
02:21:32,710 --> 02:21:30,720
illuminati or the international bankers

3919
02:21:33,910 --> 02:21:32,720
but how do we go about proving any such

3920
02:21:35,670 --> 02:21:33,920
thing

3921
02:21:38,150 --> 02:21:35,680
well that's the problem you know like

3922
02:21:40,469 --> 02:21:38,160
the broader ufo phenomena itself we have

3923
02:21:42,469 --> 02:21:40,479
anecdotal reports made by people

3924
02:21:44,469 --> 02:21:42,479
individuals some of them very credible

3925
02:21:46,150 --> 02:21:44,479
that involve strange objects or

3926
02:21:47,670 --> 02:21:46,160
illuminations that are seen in the sky

3927
02:21:49,270 --> 02:21:47,680
some of these reports come from pilots

3928
02:21:51,590 --> 02:21:49,280
some of these reports come from generals

3929
02:21:53,270 --> 02:21:51,600
some come from police officers

3930
02:21:55,270 --> 02:21:53,280
some come from just you know average

3931
02:21:57,590 --> 02:21:55,280
joes like yourself or me

3932
02:22:00,230 --> 02:21:57,600
the problem is is that to try and create

3933
02:22:02,070 --> 02:22:00,240
a strong case form or an origin story

3934
02:22:04,790 --> 02:22:02,080
for ufos that draws from the idea of

3935
02:22:06,630 --> 02:22:04,800
global elitists and secret societies

3936
02:22:08,710 --> 02:22:06,640
it relies on the same continuous threads

3937
02:22:10,790 --> 02:22:08,720
that ufology

3938
02:22:13,190 --> 02:22:10,800
in the more general sense the term uh

3939
02:22:14,630 --> 02:22:13,200
relies on it's it's all anecdotal data

3940
02:22:17,270 --> 02:22:14,640
well we know that there have been secret

3941
02:22:19,590 --> 02:22:17,280
groups we do know in 1776 that the

3942
02:22:21,429 --> 02:22:19,600
formation of the famous illuminati took

3943
02:22:23,270 --> 02:22:21,439
place we do know that in the 1830s the

3944
02:22:25,429 --> 02:22:23,280
order of skull and bones

3945
02:22:26,950 --> 02:22:25,439
made its way over to yale university we

3946
02:22:28,630 --> 02:22:26,960
we know that the bilderbergers began

3947
02:22:30,309 --> 02:22:28,640
meeting in the 1950s and that they still

3948
02:22:32,070 --> 02:22:30,319
meet today

3949
02:22:34,630 --> 02:22:32,080
but none of these

3950
02:22:37,270 --> 02:22:34,640
realities that i discuss here

3951
02:22:39,830 --> 02:22:37,280
necessarily can be conclusively tied to

3952
02:22:41,910 --> 02:22:39,840
something like ufos um

3953
02:22:44,150 --> 02:22:41,920
and that's the kind of the catch gene is

3954
02:22:45,830 --> 02:22:44,160
that while i think that

3955
02:22:47,590 --> 02:22:45,840
if we were to extrapolate on what could

3956
02:22:48,630 --> 02:22:47,600
be behind ufos

3957
02:22:50,309 --> 02:22:48,640
some people would think it would be

3958
02:22:51,750 --> 02:22:50,319
absurd to suppose that it's an earthly

3959
02:22:53,270 --> 02:22:51,760
phenomenon because the technologies

3960
02:22:55,670 --> 02:22:53,280
represented in the literature appear to

3961
02:22:57,670 --> 02:22:55,680
be far too exotic to be accounted for

3962
02:22:59,910 --> 02:22:57,680
through earthly technologies i would

3963
02:23:03,110 --> 02:22:59,920
differ in that well if we have no

3964
02:23:05,590 --> 02:23:03,120
evidence that conclusively proves alien

3965
02:23:07,110 --> 02:23:05,600
life exists aren't we creating a leap in

3966
02:23:08,150 --> 02:23:07,120
judgment to presume that therefore

3967
02:23:10,710 --> 02:23:08,160
aliens

3968
02:23:12,070 --> 02:23:10,720
are behind the ufo phenomena and so some

3969
02:23:14,630 --> 02:23:12,080
people would say in the unlikelihood

3970
02:23:16,309 --> 02:23:14,640
that aliens exist or at very least the

3971
02:23:19,190 --> 02:23:16,319
absence of evidence that we have right

3972
02:23:21,349 --> 02:23:19,200
now maybe it's more likely that aliens

3973
02:23:22,870 --> 02:23:21,359
or what we perceive as them come from

3974
02:23:25,110 --> 02:23:22,880
the future that's it's some sort of a

3975
02:23:26,309 --> 02:23:25,120
future technology you know the problem

3976
02:23:27,910 --> 02:23:26,319
is is that it seems at the end of the

3977
02:23:30,230 --> 02:23:27,920
day no matter

3978
02:23:31,990 --> 02:23:30,240
what filter we attempt to apply to ufos

3979
02:23:34,150 --> 02:23:32,000
in terms of understanding the broader

3980
02:23:36,550 --> 02:23:34,160
phenomena we don't seem to have

3981
02:23:38,150 --> 02:23:36,560
good physical evidence or hard proof we

3982
02:23:39,349 --> 02:23:38,160
don't have a smoking gun we don't have a

3983
02:23:41,030 --> 02:23:39,359
document that ties it to the

3984
02:23:42,469 --> 02:23:41,040
bilderbergers or to some other group

3985
02:23:45,270 --> 02:23:42,479
there doesn't seem to be anything that

3986
02:23:47,270 --> 02:23:45,280
conclusively ties this together for us

3987
02:23:49,190 --> 02:23:47,280
now i'm of the mind that there is a

3988
02:23:51,910 --> 02:23:49,200
phenomenon i'm of a mind that there is

3989
02:23:53,830 --> 02:23:51,920
something to the vast minority of ufo

3990
02:23:55,469 --> 02:23:53,840
reports that do constitute

3991
02:23:57,670 --> 02:23:55,479
more than just hearsay

3992
02:23:59,190 --> 02:23:57,680
misidentifications and people's hopeful

3993
02:24:01,349 --> 02:23:59,200
belief in aliens

3994
02:24:02,870 --> 02:24:01,359
whatever it is i don't know

3995
02:24:04,389 --> 02:24:02,880
and that seems to be where we stand

3996
02:24:05,830 --> 02:24:04,399
right now and i know that that's

3997
02:24:07,110 --> 02:24:05,840
probably um

3998
02:24:08,950 --> 02:24:07,120
it's kind of a letdown for people who

3999
02:24:10,469 --> 02:24:08,960
are looking for the ultimate truth about

4000
02:24:11,670 --> 02:24:10,479
ufos but i'd much rather tell you i

4001
02:24:13,910 --> 02:24:11,680
don't know

4002
02:24:15,910 --> 02:24:13,920
than to feed you a line and to try and

4003
02:24:18,070 --> 02:24:15,920
you know bolster my claims when i don't

4004
02:24:20,710 --> 02:24:18,080
have good proof we have micah hanks of

4005
02:24:27,990 --> 02:24:20,720
the grayling report with gene steinberg

4006
02:24:28,000 --> 02:24:32,710
thank you for listening to gcn

4007
02:24:37,270 --> 02:24:33,630
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4008
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4009
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4010
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4011
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4020
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4030
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4031
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4032
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you know that premature birth is the

4033
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number one killer of babies in the

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4035
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4037
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4038
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4039
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4040
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4041
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4042
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4043
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4045
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finest meat cooking on an open flame

4046
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freeze-dried meat from newharvest.com is

4047
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4048
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4049
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4050
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4051
02:26:27,190 --> 02:26:25,520
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4052
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4053
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4054
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4055
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4056
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4057
02:26:44,230 --> 02:26:42,399
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4058
02:26:46,309 --> 02:26:44,240
past august was when we spread his ashes

4059
02:26:48,070 --> 02:26:46,319
on the saint croix river i loved my dad

4060
02:26:50,710 --> 02:26:48,080
but boy was he stubborn he hadn't been

4061
02:26:52,790 --> 02:26:50,720
to the doctor in over 25 years his

4062
02:26:54,630 --> 02:26:52,800
excuse he simply couldn't afford it he

4063
02:26:56,590 --> 02:26:54,640
wasn't a rich man by any means at less

4064
02:26:58,309 --> 02:26:56,600
than 107 dollars per month

4065
02:27:00,630 --> 02:26:58,319
libertyoncall.org would have been the

4066
02:27:03,750 --> 02:27:00,640
perfect alternative for my father don't

4067
02:27:05,510 --> 02:27:03,760
wait go to libertyoncall.org right now

4068
02:27:06,790 --> 02:27:05,520
for not just your sake for the sake of

4069
02:27:08,710 --> 02:27:06,800
your loved ones again that's

4070
02:27:10,790 --> 02:27:08,720
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4071
02:27:12,230 --> 02:27:10,800
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4072
02:27:14,150 --> 02:27:12,240
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4073
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4074
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4075
02:27:22,070 --> 02:27:20,160
300 000 group life insurance policy but

4076
02:27:24,550 --> 02:27:22,080
is changing jobs and can't take it with

4077
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him well i am partially shot the highly

4078
02:27:28,950 --> 02:27:26,240
rated term life insurance companies we

4079
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represent and found ray who is 41 and

4080
02:27:34,230 --> 02:27:30,399
takes medication to control his

4081
02:27:36,870 --> 02:27:34,240
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4082
02:27:39,110 --> 02:27:36,880
under 26 dollars a month that's almost

4083
02:27:41,349 --> 02:27:39,120
twice the coverage for less than half of

4084
02:27:43,110 --> 02:27:41,359
what he had paid if select quote hasn't

4085
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shopped for your life insurance you're

4086
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probably paying too much

4087
02:27:50,160 --> 02:27:57,270
that's 1-800-403-4885

4088
02:28:02,630 --> 02:27:59,110
eight 1-800-403-4885 or go to select

4089
02:28:04,550 --> 02:28:02,640
quote dot com we shop you save get full

4090
02:28:05,510 --> 02:28:04,560
details in the example policy slogan.com

4091
02:28:06,630 --> 02:28:05,520
commercials your price could vary

4092
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depending on your health issuing company

4093
02:28:10,550 --> 02:28:07,920
and other factors not available in all

4094
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states are your google search results

4095
02:28:14,630 --> 02:28:12,479
killing you unflattering content in

4096
02:28:16,389 --> 02:28:14,640
blogs news articles online reviews

4097
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social media or other sources can

4098
02:28:21,429 --> 02:28:18,560
jeopardize your reputation your business

4099
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and your livelihood let reputation.com

4100
02:28:25,190 --> 02:28:23,439
help our patented technology will make

4101
02:28:27,510 --> 02:28:25,200
the truth about you more visible while

4102
02:28:29,830 --> 02:28:27,520
pushing down unwanted negative content

4103
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improve your google search results call

4104
02:28:33,230 --> 02:28:31,359
reputation.com

4105
02:28:44,950 --> 02:28:33,240
at

4106
02:28:50,870 --> 02:28:47,110
hi it's grant cameron from presidential

4107
02:28:58,710 --> 02:28:50,880
ufo.com you're listening to the peracast

4108
02:29:04,389 --> 02:29:01,110
he has one of those unusual voices that

4109
02:29:06,790 --> 02:29:04,399
creates its own echo effect now sometime

4110
02:29:09,750 --> 02:29:06,800
i'm going to play with the various

4111
02:29:11,349 --> 02:29:09,760
effects i can produce

4112
02:29:13,030 --> 02:29:11,359
which i can do internally but i don't

4113
02:29:15,190 --> 02:29:13,040
want people to think that i'm some kind

4114
02:29:17,270 --> 02:29:15,200
of extraterrestrial being but what we

4115
02:29:19,270 --> 02:29:17,280
are doing is looking at the secret

4116
02:29:20,469 --> 02:29:19,280
societies and all the weird stuff that's

4117
02:29:22,950 --> 02:29:20,479
going on

4118
02:29:25,349 --> 02:29:22,960
of course we're familiar with skull and

4119
02:29:27,590 --> 02:29:25,359
bone society at yale

4120
02:29:29,990 --> 02:29:27,600
where a number of presidents who went to

4121
02:29:32,469 --> 02:29:30,000
yale including w

4122
02:29:35,110 --> 02:29:32,479
were members now how do they all become

4123
02:29:37,429 --> 02:29:35,120
members of this group i guess they imply

4124
02:29:39,190 --> 02:29:37,439
when you ask them it's just fun

4125
02:29:41,349 --> 02:29:39,200
you know it's just a way of kind of

4126
02:29:43,750 --> 02:29:41,359
blowing off steam what do you think well

4127
02:29:45,830 --> 02:29:43,760
you know with yale's secret society of

4128
02:29:47,670 --> 02:29:45,840
course the order of skull and bones

4129
02:29:49,429 --> 02:29:47,680
there are some interesting

4130
02:29:50,950 --> 02:29:49,439
aspects about this and i think at the

4131
02:29:53,670 --> 02:29:50,960
end of the day

4132
02:29:55,990 --> 02:29:53,680
the ritual aspect of this is an element

4133
02:29:57,910 --> 02:29:56,000
of absurdity that is prevalent in a lot

4134
02:29:59,830 --> 02:29:57,920
of secret societies specifically of

4135
02:30:01,830 --> 02:29:59,840
course they're the initiation rights

4136
02:30:03,190 --> 02:30:01,840
which um some have said and this is the

4137
02:30:05,270 --> 02:30:03,200
thing is that a lot of this is kept out

4138
02:30:06,710 --> 02:30:05,280
of you know public record but there are

4139
02:30:08,550 --> 02:30:06,720
whispers about what actually happens

4140
02:30:10,469 --> 02:30:08,560
that involve lying in a coffin and

4141
02:30:11,750 --> 02:30:10,479
recounting various past experiences of

4142
02:30:13,910 --> 02:30:11,760
different kinds

4143
02:30:16,309 --> 02:30:13,920
what's interesting is that that is um

4144
02:30:20,070 --> 02:30:16,319
one of many elements that emerge that uh

4145
02:30:21,750 --> 02:30:20,080
kind of tie in death or macabre imagery

4146
02:30:23,670 --> 02:30:21,760
you know skulls and crossbones and

4147
02:30:25,990 --> 02:30:23,680
corpses and things like this they aren't

4148
02:30:27,910 --> 02:30:26,000
the only group that uh utilizes this

4149
02:30:29,030 --> 02:30:27,920
kind of macabre imagery there's another

4150
02:30:30,550 --> 02:30:29,040
actually that's associated with

4151
02:30:33,030 --> 02:30:30,560
washington and lee university that's

4152
02:30:34,550 --> 02:30:33,040
called the cadaver society lesser known

4153
02:30:36,389 --> 02:30:34,560
than skull and bones and probably for

4154
02:30:38,469 --> 02:30:36,399
one simple reason for whatever the case

4155
02:30:39,910 --> 02:30:38,479
is you pointed out with w being involved

4156
02:30:41,349 --> 02:30:39,920
his father before him george herbert

4157
02:30:43,429 --> 02:30:41,359
walker bush and then his father before

4158
02:30:45,510 --> 02:30:43,439
him prescott bush the point is is that

4159
02:30:48,230 --> 02:30:45,520
all three of the bushes were also

4160
02:30:50,070 --> 02:30:48,240
bonesmen with yale's skull and bones and

4161
02:30:51,830 --> 02:30:50,080
there were a lot of other people of note

4162
02:30:55,030 --> 02:30:51,840
who have been members of skull and bones

4163
02:30:55,910 --> 02:30:55,040
william howard taft uh percy rockefeller

4164
02:30:57,510 --> 02:30:55,920
we had

4165
02:30:59,910 --> 02:30:57,520
i think william f buckley the political

4166
02:31:01,270 --> 02:30:59,920
writer john kerry uh david mccullough

4167
02:31:03,030 --> 02:31:01,280
you know so there's been a lot of them

4168
02:31:04,710 --> 02:31:03,040
uh but the point is is that uh for

4169
02:31:06,309 --> 02:31:04,720
whatever reason yale being i think you

4170
02:31:08,070 --> 02:31:06,319
know at the top tier as far as ivy

4171
02:31:09,590 --> 02:31:08,080
league schools go their secret society

4172
02:31:12,230 --> 02:31:09,600
does seem to have

4173
02:31:14,389 --> 02:31:12,240
some sway and influence over those who

4174
02:31:16,469 --> 02:31:14,399
go on to have careers in politics and

4175
02:31:18,469 --> 02:31:16,479
government and whatnot but many of these

4176
02:31:21,590 --> 02:31:18,479
fraternal societies associated with

4177
02:31:24,230 --> 02:31:21,600
these universities they they do employ a

4178
02:31:25,670 --> 02:31:24,240
kind of you know macabre imagery and

4179
02:31:28,150 --> 02:31:25,680
that seems to be something that harkens

4180
02:31:30,230 --> 02:31:28,160
back to the early days of the mysteries

4181
02:31:32,230 --> 02:31:30,240
you know the druidic cults you know of

4182
02:31:33,830 --> 02:31:32,240
of europe you know the ancient egyptian

4183
02:31:35,510 --> 02:31:33,840
religions and whatnot they involved a

4184
02:31:38,630 --> 02:31:35,520
lot of things that included

4185
02:31:39,990 --> 02:31:38,640
the idea of death and then rebirth uh

4186
02:31:41,510 --> 02:31:40,000
this is something that was written an

4187
02:31:43,270 --> 02:31:41,520
awful lot about by

4188
02:31:45,670 --> 02:31:43,280
sir james george frazier in his book the

4189
02:31:47,670 --> 02:31:45,680
golden bough manly p hall in his book

4190
02:31:49,670 --> 02:31:47,680
the secret teachings of all ages uh and

4191
02:31:52,469 --> 02:31:49,680
other literature talked a lot about the

4192
02:31:54,790 --> 02:31:52,479
ancient mysteries and the way that the

4193
02:31:57,190 --> 02:31:54,800
traditions in those organizations that

4194
02:31:59,190 --> 02:31:57,200
involve death and rebirth burial and

4195
02:32:00,950 --> 02:31:59,200
coffin through initiation which

4196
02:32:02,870 --> 02:32:00,960
symbolized the death of the sun god

4197
02:32:05,429 --> 02:32:02,880
heliocentrism or i guess you know

4198
02:32:07,910 --> 02:32:05,439
worship of the sun was central to a lot

4199
02:32:09,670 --> 02:32:07,920
of these ancient groups and whatever the

4200
02:32:11,429 --> 02:32:09,680
method was that it made its way down

4201
02:32:12,870 --> 02:32:11,439
these same sorts of traditions have been

4202
02:32:15,110 --> 02:32:12,880
carried on to the modern secret

4203
02:32:17,750 --> 02:32:15,120
societies and so this kind of uh

4204
02:32:19,190 --> 02:32:17,760
this ritual component absurd though it

4205
02:32:21,270 --> 02:32:19,200
is at times is something that is

4206
02:32:23,510 --> 02:32:21,280
borrowed directly from the ancient

4207
02:32:25,910 --> 02:32:23,520
mystery to traditions of ancient times

4208
02:32:27,590 --> 02:32:25,920
the archaic groups of philosophers that

4209
02:32:30,070 --> 02:32:27,600
would gather together with one's central

4210
02:32:31,590 --> 02:32:30,080
focus that secret wisdom

4211
02:32:33,990 --> 02:32:31,600
existed that it could be obtained and

4212
02:32:35,830 --> 02:32:34,000
collected and that maybe only certain

4213
02:32:37,510 --> 02:32:35,840
members of society should be able to

4214
02:32:39,349 --> 02:32:37,520
have access to that information but that

4215
02:32:40,710 --> 02:32:39,359
it should be carried on throughout the

4216
02:32:42,870 --> 02:32:40,720
ages and this is really the fundamental

4217
02:32:44,630 --> 02:32:42,880
role secret societies have played

4218
02:32:47,270 --> 02:32:44,640
since time immemorial

4219
02:32:49,750 --> 02:32:47,280
we have all these organizations

4220
02:32:51,670 --> 02:32:49,760
and we have all these things that people

4221
02:32:52,469 --> 02:32:51,680
involved in government do

4222
02:32:55,270 --> 02:32:52,479
that

4223
02:32:57,190 --> 02:32:55,280
gives rise to conspiracy theories now in

4224
02:32:58,230 --> 02:32:57,200
a previous segment you mentioned in

4225
02:33:00,230 --> 02:32:58,240
passing

4226
02:33:02,550 --> 02:33:00,240
some of the news that's come out lately

4227
02:33:05,990 --> 02:33:02,560
about something called the panama papers

4228
02:33:08,790 --> 02:33:06,000
which again vladimir putin supposedly

4229
02:33:10,630 --> 02:33:08,800
had hidden some of his money maybe in

4230
02:33:12,790 --> 02:33:10,640
the waning moments of this show we could

4231
02:33:14,710 --> 02:33:12,800
maybe focus on that just a little bit

4232
02:33:17,590 --> 02:33:14,720
more because it certainly gives rise to

4233
02:33:19,830 --> 02:33:17,600
all sorts of conspiracy theories um and

4234
02:33:21,990 --> 02:33:19,840
more so than putin himself close friends

4235
02:33:23,990 --> 02:33:22,000
and associates of his including i think

4236
02:33:26,309 --> 02:33:24,000
one famous cellist who was a friend of

4237
02:33:27,990 --> 02:33:26,319
his a lot of people and it wasn't just

4238
02:33:30,550 --> 02:33:28,000
vladimir putin it was

4239
02:33:32,950 --> 02:33:30,560
also i think one of the most notable

4240
02:33:34,630 --> 02:33:32,960
world leaders who was tied in with this

4241
02:33:36,870 --> 02:33:34,640
which actually led to his resignation

4242
02:33:39,190 --> 02:33:36,880
was the prime minister of iceland

4243
02:33:41,349 --> 02:33:39,200
this mosaic fonseca thing and that's a

4244
02:33:43,349 --> 02:33:41,359
reference to the actual banking firm in

4245
02:33:44,630 --> 02:33:43,359
panama it's pretty interesting i think

4246
02:33:47,110 --> 02:33:44,640
this really kind of goes back to early

4247
02:33:49,190 --> 02:33:47,120
2015 there was a german newspaper i

4248
02:33:52,230 --> 02:33:49,200
think it's seduced

4249
02:33:54,710 --> 02:33:52,240
is the one that began having information

4250
02:33:56,550 --> 02:33:54,720
leaked to them by a hacker this is

4251
02:33:58,469 --> 02:33:56,560
really gene kind of similar to what

4252
02:34:00,550 --> 02:33:58,479
ended up happening with edward snowden

4253
02:34:02,550 --> 02:34:00,560
and yet strangely there's very little

4254
02:34:04,469 --> 02:34:02,560
being said there's a big splash when it

4255
02:34:05,830 --> 02:34:04,479
first broke about the panama papers it's

4256
02:34:07,830 --> 02:34:05,840
not something that has maintained a

4257
02:34:09,270 --> 02:34:07,840
presence i think like the ongoing

4258
02:34:11,670 --> 02:34:09,280
revelations of edward snowden and

4259
02:34:13,990 --> 02:34:11,680
similar data leaks wikileaks you know

4260
02:34:16,150 --> 02:34:14,000
have done this in the past i'm amazed at

4261
02:34:18,230 --> 02:34:16,160
how little is being said about the

4262
02:34:20,230 --> 02:34:18,240
panama papers compared with other

4263
02:34:21,750 --> 02:34:20,240
similar data leaks in in the past

4264
02:34:23,510 --> 02:34:21,760
despite the fact that the panama papers

4265
02:34:24,870 --> 02:34:23,520
represents what many have said and i

4266
02:34:27,110 --> 02:34:24,880
think that this is a factual statement

4267
02:34:28,950 --> 02:34:27,120
it is the largest data leak of its kind

4268
02:34:30,710 --> 02:34:28,960
in all history so again a hacker has

4269
02:34:33,429 --> 02:34:30,720
managed to gain access to these

4270
02:34:35,349 --> 02:34:33,439
documents that tie world leaders to any

4271
02:34:37,830 --> 02:34:35,359
number of different organizations uh and

4272
02:34:40,389 --> 02:34:37,840
and of course their operations with the

4273
02:34:43,190 --> 02:34:40,399
fonseca group and the utilization of

4274
02:34:45,590 --> 02:34:43,200
offshore banking uh hijinks to get

4275
02:34:47,030 --> 02:34:45,600
around taxation you know and so there

4276
02:34:48,790 --> 02:34:47,040
was this quote which i featured

4277
02:34:50,790 --> 02:34:48,800
elsewhere but i'll read a little of it

4278
02:34:52,469 --> 02:34:50,800
for you really quickly right here it was

4279
02:34:54,870 --> 02:34:52,479
the one mention of the whole entire

4280
02:34:56,790 --> 02:34:54,880
panama papers situation in time magazine

4281
02:34:58,389 --> 02:34:56,800
something very deserving of a cover

4282
02:34:59,990 --> 02:34:58,399
story this is all that was said in the

4283
02:35:02,230 --> 02:35:00,000
briefing section it said in the us the

4284
02:35:04,309 --> 02:35:02,240
impact of fonseca thing is sure to be

4285
02:35:05,910 --> 02:35:04,319
felt at the ballot box talking about the

4286
02:35:07,429 --> 02:35:05,920
2016 election

4287
02:35:09,030 --> 02:35:07,439
many american voters already feel on a

4288
02:35:10,389 --> 02:35:09,040
gut level the global capitalism is

4289
02:35:12,070 --> 02:35:10,399
working mainly for the one percent and

4290
02:35:13,910 --> 02:35:12,080
not the 99 and that this has fueled the

4291
02:35:15,910 --> 02:35:13,920
candidacies of both bernie sanders and

4292
02:35:17,429 --> 02:35:15,920
billionaire donald trump but the panama

4293
02:35:19,349 --> 02:35:17,439
papers go beyond gut feelings to

4294
02:35:21,030 --> 02:35:19,359
eliminate a key aspect of why the system

4295
02:35:23,830 --> 02:35:21,040
is working and this is what they state

4296
02:35:25,670 --> 02:35:23,840
in time namely that globalization has

4297
02:35:27,750 --> 02:35:25,680
allowed the capital and assets of the

4298
02:35:30,070 --> 02:35:27,760
rich to travel more freely even than

4299
02:35:32,150 --> 02:35:30,080
those of everyone else and the result is

4300
02:35:34,550 --> 02:35:32,160
rampant tax avoidance labor offshoring

4301
02:35:35,990 --> 02:35:34,560
and a class of elites that flies 35 000

4302
02:35:37,750 --> 02:35:36,000
feet over the problems and nations of

4303
02:35:39,830 --> 02:35:37,760
their taxpayers i would just say that

4304
02:35:41,830 --> 02:35:39,840
that statement right there gene what

4305
02:35:43,590 --> 02:35:41,840
little was said in time nonetheless i

4306
02:35:45,590 --> 02:35:43,600
think illustrates the aims and

4307
02:35:47,510 --> 02:35:45,600
objectives of global groups today that

4308
02:35:50,309 --> 02:35:47,520
effort toward globalization

4309
02:35:51,830 --> 02:35:50,319
and the benefit of it is as described

4310
02:35:54,469 --> 02:35:51,840
right there tax avoidance labor

4311
02:35:56,309 --> 02:35:54,479
offshoring and elites who have access to

4312
02:35:59,750 --> 02:35:56,319
funds and can do with what they want

4313
02:36:02,070 --> 02:35:59,760
when they want in ways that the 99 are

4314
02:36:03,910 --> 02:36:02,080
not able to and that seems to be

4315
02:36:05,910 --> 02:36:03,920
conspiratorial though it may sound a

4316
02:36:07,990 --> 02:36:05,920
very legitimate reality in the world

4317
02:36:10,230 --> 02:36:08,000
today which many either overlook or

4318
02:36:12,230 --> 02:36:10,240
simply not aware of at all

4319
02:36:14,070 --> 02:36:12,240
now one thing some politicians do is

4320
02:36:15,590 --> 02:36:14,080
they pretend they're for the little guy

4321
02:36:17,990 --> 02:36:15,600
we're going to have policies here that

4322
02:36:20,150 --> 02:36:18,000
will get you more jobs so if we cut

4323
02:36:22,469 --> 02:36:20,160
taxes for the rich it'll filter down

4324
02:36:24,790 --> 02:36:22,479
trickle down to you of course people

4325
02:36:26,790 --> 02:36:24,800
finally realized 30 years after this was

4326
02:36:28,950 --> 02:36:26,800
first proposed in the 80s

4327
02:36:31,349 --> 02:36:28,960
that this doesn't work

4328
02:36:33,830 --> 02:36:31,359
micah hanks take a few seconds here and

4329
02:36:35,750 --> 02:36:33,840
tell us more about the things you do i

4330
02:36:37,510 --> 02:36:35,760
produced the grayling report podcast and

4331
02:36:39,429 --> 02:36:37,520
occasionally i come on as a guest or a

4332
02:36:42,070 --> 02:36:39,439
co-host on this one i've got another

4333
02:36:43,270 --> 02:36:42,080
podcast that many listeners are probably

4334
02:36:44,230 --> 02:36:43,280
less aware of which is called middle

4335
02:36:45,830 --> 02:36:44,240
theory and you can find that at

4336
02:36:47,270 --> 02:36:45,840
middletheory.com

4337
02:36:48,309 --> 02:36:47,280
that show deals with news and current

4338
02:36:50,389 --> 02:36:48,319
events and the sort of stuff that we

4339
02:36:52,309 --> 02:36:50,399
were just talking about in this

4340
02:36:54,550 --> 02:36:52,319
segment if you'd like to look at the

4341
02:36:56,230 --> 02:36:54,560
discussion about ufos that we featured a

4342
02:36:59,750 --> 02:36:56,240
bit in the last hour i've got the

4343
02:37:01,590 --> 02:36:59,760
article up at micahhanks.com on ufos and

4344
02:37:03,429 --> 02:37:01,600
applying science to it and in the next

4345
02:37:06,389 --> 02:37:03,439
few days also look for an article about

4346
02:37:08,550 --> 02:37:06,399
a brief history of secret societies in

4347
02:37:09,990 --> 02:37:08,560
the western world and their influence on

4348
02:37:11,110 --> 02:37:10,000
global affairs that's also an interest

4349
02:37:12,550 --> 02:37:11,120
of mine and i'm glad to be able to come

4350
02:37:15,030 --> 02:37:12,560
on and talk about it with you here on

4351
02:37:17,510 --> 02:37:15,040
the paracast you can find us on twitter

4352
02:37:20,870 --> 02:37:17,520
look for the powercast on twitter also

4353
02:37:23,349 --> 02:37:20,880
check out two not one but two official

4354
02:37:25,110 --> 02:37:23,359
power cast fan clubs on facebook and i

4355
02:37:27,590 --> 02:37:25,120
see now that facebook is growing by

4356
02:37:30,070 --> 02:37:27,600
leaps and bounds so somehow we've got to

4357
02:37:31,750 --> 02:37:30,080
figure out how to take that to the next

4358
02:37:34,630 --> 02:37:31,760
level so if you are

4359
02:37:37,590 --> 02:37:34,640
a facebook expert write us here at the

4360
02:37:39,910 --> 02:37:37,600
powercast news at the powercast.com

4361
02:37:42,870 --> 02:37:39,920
and tell us how you can help us we have

4362
02:37:43,990 --> 02:37:42,880
a budget i assure you of exactly

4363
02:37:45,429 --> 02:37:44,000
zero

4364
02:37:48,429 --> 02:37:45,439
but you can help with that too if you

4365
02:37:52,469 --> 02:37:48,439
sign up for the powercast plus go to

4366
02:37:57,349 --> 02:37:54,710
we offer the ad free version of this

4367
02:37:59,270 --> 02:37:57,359
show no network ads higher quality

4368
02:38:00,550 --> 02:37:59,280
audios therefore special version of

4369
02:38:02,230 --> 02:38:00,560
these episodes

4370
02:38:04,630 --> 02:38:02,240
we also give you the after the power

4371
02:38:06,630 --> 02:38:04,640
cast podcast and by the way neighbors

4372
02:38:09,030 --> 02:38:06,640
michael hanks will be joining us on

4373
02:38:10,389 --> 02:38:09,040
after the powercast to add to these

4374
02:38:12,630 --> 02:38:10,399
discussions and have some other

4375
02:38:16,550 --> 02:38:12,640
discussions next week we'll be hearing

4376
02:38:18,870 --> 02:38:16,560
from guest co-host greg bishop

4377
02:38:20,469 --> 02:38:18,880
of course chris will be back soon when

4378
02:38:21,590 --> 02:38:20,479
he's finished with his walkabout in the

4379
02:38:23,590 --> 02:38:21,600
meantime

4380
02:38:25,750 --> 02:38:23,600
at the powercast plus

4381
02:38:27,910 --> 02:38:25,760
we also offer

4382
02:38:30,070 --> 02:38:27,920
some show transcripts we're starting a

4383
02:38:32,950 --> 02:38:30,080
video channel and more to come

4384
02:38:35,429 --> 02:38:32,960
a modest subscription rate gets you the

4385
02:38:37,190 --> 02:38:35,439
power cast plus we have a spring sale on

4386
02:38:38,389 --> 02:38:37,200
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4387
02:38:39,510 --> 02:38:38,399
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4388
02:38:42,150 --> 02:38:39,520
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4389
02:38:43,990 --> 02:38:42,160
plus.theparacast.com

4390
02:38:46,790 --> 02:38:44,000
micahax thank you for joining us on the

4391
02:38:55,510 --> 02:38:46,800
powercast well it is always my pleasure

4392
02:39:01,349 --> 02:38:58,469
the powercast featuring gene steinberg

4393
02:39:04,309 --> 02:39:01,359
and christopher o'brien is a copyrighted

4394
02:39:06,070 --> 02:39:04,319
presentation of making the impossible

4395
02:39:10,230 --> 02:39:06,080
incorporated